Esoteric DV-50: Any cdp's Significantly better?

I've heard the DV 50 in two systems. I think it does a fine job playing redbook. Unfortunately, I did not get a chance to hear it up against another model of comparable or lower cost playing redbook. However, against a much more expensive DAC/Transport combination by the Swiss firm Ensemble, I did manage to get some impression about the nature of its sound.

The DV 50 is warmer and has a more prominent midbass than the Ensemble. Whether the leaner presentation of the Ensemble is a plus or minus would depend on taste and system balancing. The Ensemble was also much more articulate, dynamic and detailed -- the DV 50 sounding a bit muddled by comparison. The Ensemble also had a much more open and airy top end. The more incisive attack of the note on the Ensemble did give it a bit more sibilant and mechanical sound, so my personal ideal would fall somewhere between the two players.

I personally gave away the Sony SCD-1 player I had for four years in favor of a CD-only player that does a MUCH better job with redbook (Naim CDS 3). There was not enough SACD material out there to interest me and the superiority of my current machine on redbook versus the SCD-1 swamped the difference between SACD and CD on the Sony. I may some day be back into some "hi-rez" format in the future when more software is available and the technology is further refined.

Russellcncom, I don't think that the Lector can play SACD. Are you thinking about the not yet released Lector Prestige or the 7t?

Hey guys,

Thanks for keeping this thread alive! People are starting to bring up a lot of good points and mentioning a lot of good cd players. Before I address individual comments I'd
like to give out some valuable information that everyone will find helpful:

www.amusicdirect.com is an audiophile store that carrys a wide selection of audiophile cd's. However, many people don't know they are authorized dealers for Marantz, McCormack and Esoteric to name a few. They have a 30 day return policy on anything you buy. So those of you interested in the DV 50, McCormack UDP-1 or the very new Marantz SA 11 (replacing the 14) can order one, do a home demo and if not satisfied return it and get a full refund. You're only responsible for shipping charges. Marantz just came out with the DV 9500 (replacing their universal DV 8400) and the audio quality is supposed to be vastly superior to the 8400. It retails for $2,000. I have not heard it.

There's also www.usedcables.com. You can check out any interconnect or speaker cable for a small deposit. They also carry Esoteric and you can get a free home demo.

Now, to answer your questions:

Guidocorona, the Krell SACD player is decidely different from the rest of Krell's cd players..which normally exhibit strong bass, agressive and forward presentation with gobs of detail. The SACD standard is smooth, analog sounding and very even handed across the total frequency range. Some will find its presentation more to their liking than teh DV 50. I felt it was boring and mechanical. All the elements were there but it didn't excite me. But that's my peronsal opinion.

I keep hearing such great things about the Audio Rsearch CD III and the AudioMeca Research Mephisto II and I would LOVE TO HEAR THESE TWO. Both of these players have been around for a while and have a strong and loyal customer base. I believe these two players are at the very top of the list of the best players out there and they probably outperform the DV-50. But I haven't heard them to confirm.

Ggil, The McCormack UDP-1 lives up to the hype in terms of its redbook performance. Very nice, transparent, good soundstage, fine detail..probably on the level of the Arcam CD 33T or the Ayre Cx-7..both of which I feel are excellent cd players. However, the DVD-A, SACD and especially the DVD-Video is not on the same level as the redbook cd playback..which is a shame since SACD has the potential to consistently outperform redbook. My feeling is if you're going to pay for a universal player you should get one that stives to be great for all forms of playback.

Bye the way, I should add no one ever talks about the video on the DV-50 but it is also outstanding. The new version (DV-50S) is suppose to be even better on video due to an improved video dac and DVI output.

Manineiac & Russell, I've heard very, very good things about the Lector and the Naim cd players but have yet to hear them. However, I'm starting to see a trend where players that utilize seperate power supplies (seperate from the transport chasis) seem to have outstanding performance. Naim, Lector, Resolution Audio, Shiguraki Flatfish, etc all fall in this category. I'm thinking all of these players probably are at least equal to the DV 50...the Lector more musical and the Resolution Audio better detail, soundstage..just better. But to what degree I'm not sure.

Remember, when I started this thread I was looking for a player that significantly beats the pants off the DV 50 in terms of redbook performance. Two members feel the modded Denon 2900 from Exemplar does. I will find out shortly. But if all the players above only beat the DV 50 by a 5-10% margin it 's not worth losing DVD-A, SACD and DVD-Video playback for a small increase in redbook performance. SACD playback on the DV-50 is even better than redbook.

I'm thinking the Resolution Audio, Lector, Audio Rsearch and Memphisto maybe the players that siginificantly improve upon my DV 50 in redbook. Next week I hope to get a chance to listen to the daddy of all cd players...the Reimyo CDP 777 that retails for $14,000. many people believe this is the best cd player period in the market...However those who own Meitner gear and DCS Verdi gear may beg to differ. I'd also love to demo a high end Levinson cd player as I'm sure it will DEFINITELY give me a significant improvement over the DV-50...but the price of all these units is very steep.

Sim Audio just introduced a new universal called the Orbiter that retails new for $6,500. I have a lot of respect for Sim Audio and the pictures of it are stunning. Anyone heard a demo of this player?

Finally, many of the people that I've corresponded or talked that were not overly impressed with the DV 50 DID NOT DEMO IT THROUGH THE BALANCED OUTPUTS. I (as did Stereophile and Soundstage) found the balanced performance to be vastly superior to the RCA analog out performance. So, if you do not own a pre/pro with balanced inputs you will not have heard the DV 50 at its full potential. Esoteric makes it clear in their brochure that the DV 50 is a fully balanced design and needs to be operated balanced.

It's amazing to me how many people can spend $5,500 on a cd player but match it up with receivers or cheaper pre/pro's that don't have balanced inputs. Good components need to be matched with other components of like quality to realize their full potential! I personally would not buy a Lector Cd player if I did not have a pre/pro with balanced inputs...nor would I use it with a reciever...even a very high end one. It doesn't make sense to me.

Again, comments/suggestions wanted and appreciated..as well as thoughts on the new Sim Audio Orbiter!

AVGURU

Since your D1 seems to have a quality DAC and can take a digital input, why not use a quality Redbook transport for CDs and a separate DVD player? Have you tried running
the digital output of the DV-50 into the D1?

For the same money as the DV-50, you could also use one of the Theta transports.

Hi, Peter here Guido's friend. I have yet to hear a DV50. I'm still thinking about the Sony SCD-XA9000. Last December, Atkinson gave it a great review. Others have proclaimed it wonderful on SACD, but maybe showing some compromises on Redbook. I'd love to hear theMarantz SA-11, but I was at the Marantz dealer today and he didn't have one. I did get to hear the DV-9500 and also the Linn 2.1. The 9500 was quite good, but I felt lost its focus to an unreasonable degree with Redbook. The Linn 2.1 was very dimensional, focused and detailed. Some have reported that the Linn sounds "dry." This was not my experience. It had great extended highs. Perhaps, some have felt that its bass is lean. To me, the bass was tight and very fast. The Marantz, with which I did a side by side comparison had more bass extension for sure, but it tended to be muddy sounding next to the Linn. I use an LP12 turntable, so I may be just spoiled by that tight Linn sound.
Another player that has gotten stellar reviews, but hasn't been mentioned is the Accuphase DP77. Has anyone heard it? List is $8500, I believe. I don't know that I can go that much on a new front-end, but I'd like to get something very good for the money. That's why I'm quite anxious to hear first-hand reports on the $3k Sony and the $3K Marantz SA-11.
As Guido mentioned, I have a Denon 2200. He was kind in his paraphrase of my opinion. In reality, it's a real stinker. It's actually pretty acceptable on Redbook, but sounds bright and glarey with SACD and unnaturally balanced toward the bottom with DVD Audio. I bought it mainly on the basis of a quite positive mention in TAS 149 relative to some other players that cost more, but I failed to read between the lines enough to realize the level of compromise I'd be making.
On a side note, I was at the dealer today to picj up my newly modded LP12 with its brand new Clearaudio Virtuoso Wood cartridge and even with no break-in it smokes most other music sources with which I'm familiar!