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Tonearms longer than 12 inches

I'm curious to hear anyone's speculations on the
future of tonearm developement. What could be improved ?
As well, what lengths could we reasonably expect to see
in a pivoting arm ? 14 inch ? 16 inch ?
noslepums
hwsworkshop
36 posts
 

I agree Raul, the 10" Prime/Classic length arm is the one I recommend for almost everyone.  It is rigid (good bass) it is quiet (3D printing), it is easy to set up correctly, and does not cost an arm and a leg..  The Prime arm just got Product of the Year from Hi-FI Plus in England and the Prime has gotten more amazing reviews internationally than any table we have ever made mostly due to that arm!!  That 10" distance is the magic number for 99% of my customers.

The problem is I have 7 tape machines and hundreds of tapes, many of them master copies, and the 12" 3D printed arm sounds more like the tape than the 10" does.  We are talking subtle, it is not gob smack in the face!!!  It is a painstaking setup though and is probably not worth the energy in the end.

My son has been helping me clean up my basement and found a notebook from my days in college, opens it up and sees a math problem that took two pages to solve, it was about an electron in free space.  I get the math, I believe in math, but in the end I have the reference tape they made the record with on the same tape machine they made the record with so what is right is right, the 12" arm sounds very subtly more like the tape in the upper midrange, those violins are so smooth!!!!!

Raul, you correct about those long Japanese arms, I have been quietly selling off my SAEC and my FR-66 and others because they just don't cut it anymore.  Too many parts, too much metal, too much mass!!  Really nice to look at though.

HW

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albertporter
4,949 posts
 
The problem is I have 7 tape machines and hundreds of tapes, many of them master copies, and the 12" 3D printed arm sounds more like the tape than the 10" does. We are talking subtle, it is not gob smack in the face!!! It is a painstaking setup though and is probably not worth the energy in the end
Exactly my experience although I have owned only three tape machines and have fewer master copies.
hwsworkshop
36 posts
 

Is this the Albert Porter I have heard about over the years with the Technics tables???  Or am I old enough to be hallucinating again!!!

If so it is nice to meet you.

HW

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albertporter
4,949 posts
 

Is this the Albert Porter I have heard about over the years with the Technics tables??? Or am I old enough to be hallucinating again!!!

If so it is nice to meet you.

HW

Hello Harry,

Yes, I am the guy that prefers Technics SP10MK3 and 12" tonearms. 

You probably don't remember but years ago I bought a VPI 17F and wanted it to have two tanks and two pick up wands.  I had the "bright" idea of using a second pure water rinse.

You were incredibly patient with me, sold me the VPI plus extra parts and after I failed to figure out how to adapt the machine to accept extra parts, you took them back and allowed me apply as credit to spare pick up tubes, cleaner and other parts.

I still remember your kindness and still think the VPI 17 is one of the most important products in the history of audio.   Although I have other kinds of cleaning machines today I still stand by the fact that VPI was there early and produced major improvements for early adopters.   Heck, it’s still among the best machines after all these years and after dozens of other companies stole your ideas.

I was pleased to see your name here at Audiogon.   We need more industry professionals posting to our forums. 



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rauliruegas
12,781 posts
 
Dear hw:  """   you correct about those long Japanese arms, I have been quietly selling off my SAEC and my FR-66 and others because they just don't cut it anymore. Too many parts, too much metal, too much mass!! Really nice to look at though.... """"

I remember how proud was when I received my two long tonearms by SAEC ( we-8000 and 506/30 ). I t was a real " dream come through " for me and when I mounted and saw them my ( one after the other ) WOW's expressions where and makes me a happy audiophile  as never before. Every time one of my audio friends were at my place every one of them always had the same WOW! expresions.

Now ( time latter. ) when I learned, can understand that that WOW! was the clasic WOW! that always gives the  ignorance. That's ( today )  similar to that WOW! when we are in front of a " 300 kg. " turntables, just real audio ignorance and whealty pockets: nothing more.

SAEC, FR and many other vintage tonearms and some of the today ones are only ignorance WOW's! and reflects our audiophile level and always I said that's nothing wrong with that because we like it and we like different kind of distortions with different distortion levels.

I remember the Dr. Sao Win   recomendation in his LOMC cartridge manual: don't use a tonearm with knife bearing type ( SAEC use it. ) and look for extremely stable bearing tonearm during play. His answer to me was to avoid unipivots and I think is right but the best judgment about is the one each one has on the overall subjects.

Where are my SAEC, FR, MS, Audiocraft and others long tonearms?, I don't really know but are not with me. 

What I can tell any one is that I learned and still learning each single day.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
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