High value, high efficiency speakers for SET amps


Hi, Gang,
I know that some of what I want to discuss here has been dealt with in other threads, some of them quite old, but I wanted to see if any of you fine, knowledgable folks are willing to help update and consolidate some of this info in a more current thread.
I am currently running my new Audio Note Kit 1 300B SET amp with a pair of Reference 3A De Capo speakers. I think it's a fine pairing and I am really enjoying what the 300B SET experience brings to the table in terms of musicality and emotional connection.
Still the De Capo, while supposedly an easy load due to its crossover-less design (only 1 cap on the tweeter with the mid-woofer directly coupled to the amp), is "only" rated at 92 db efficient, and based on the most recent Canadian NRC specs, that rating may be optimistic.
So, I am toying with the idea of trying a pair of more efficient, deliberately SET-friendly speakers in my rig, something that might also play lower and with greater dynamic swing than the De Capo's. Note that the De Capo's have served me well and I am very fond of them, but I can't help but wonder if my lovely Kit 1 would shine even better coupled to a VERY easy to drive speaker.
Devore and Audio Note are obvious options - the O/96 looks really tasty. Unfortunately, both of those choices are out of my budget, which I'm thinking maxes out (for real) at around $1500. I am willing to consider used equipment.
Tekton Lore 2.0: This is the speaker that Eric Alexander of Tekton has recommended when we've spoken on the phone, based upon my medium-small listening room and amp. I've read the epic "Lore vs. Zu" thread elsewhere in this forum, and clearly Tekton has its enthusiastic fans here. What I wonder is whether the Lore 2.0 has the refinement of the De Capo in terms of resolution, sweet high end and imaging. Audiogon'er Mikirob has pointed me to the many rave reviews of Tekton's speakers and I'm definitely interested.
I've corresponded with the Sonist folks (who are super nice) but their really high-efficiency, nearly-full-range floor stander is out of my budget.
Then there's the "vintage" route, going after some used JBL's or other high-efficiency "classics" from the 80's (or '70's). I am not inclined to go in this direction, but mention it because it's been suggested to me.
And then there's Omega. I spoke to Louis some time ago and he recommended his 7XRS hemp cone model. But I know all the raps on single driver designs and I'm cautious, although I would like to hear from any of you who own or have owned Omega's.
I'm in no rush to make a switch but I am very interested in your thoughts. Thanks, folks!
rebbi
04-22-15: Mapman
Atmasphere,
I think you are assuming that the speaker is full or near full range with your numbers. Smaller speakers with less low end extension MUST require less power to achieve a certain level, all else the same. The lower the frequencies attempted, the more power is needed, all else held constant. I think that is basic physics. So I think my argument is sound that one way to coax more out of a few good watts is to defer on or even filter out the lowest frequencies if needed one way or another at some point. That allows your watts to go further.
I would put it that deep bass extension, efficiency, and compactness of cabinet size trade off against one another in the design of a speaker. Sacrificing deep bass extension and/or making the cabinet larger (not smaller) will work in the direction of enabling the speaker to have greater efficiency.

So I agree that in choosing a speaker having significantly greater efficiency than the De Capo, that also meets Rebbi's stated price point and size preferences, much or all of the bottom two octaves or so will probably have to be sacrificed.

However, the efficiency of a given speaker is what it is. (Although that is not to say that it is what the specs say it is :-)) And provided that the efficiency number is defined in a way that is representative of the speaker's performance across the range of frequencies it is capable of reproducing with reasonably flat frequency response, a speaker having an efficiency of 102 db/1W/1m, to use Ralph's example, will produce within that frequency range an SPL of 102 db (+/- frequency response variation) at a distance of 1 meter when provided with 1 watt (neglecting room effects), regardless of what the speaker's deep bass extension is.

Regarding filtering out the deep bass at a point upstream of the amplifier, yes, that of course would make a given number of watts go further, but of course implementing that filter without compromising the SET magic is another matter, especially at a modest price point.

On the other hand, though, how far the 2 watt figure Ralph mentioned will go in conjunction with a given speaker efficiency will of course vary considerably depending on the volume preferences, listening distance, and room size of the listener, and perhaps even more so on the dynamic range of the music that is being listened to. And it seems clear in this case that Rebbi is generally quite happy with the performance of his SET amplifier with the 86.7 db/2.83 volt/1 meter De Capos. My guess, therefore, is that a speaker which honestly gets into the mid-90's/1 watt/1 meter, while also not compromising anything about the De Capo's sonics which he finds appealing, would make for an excellent upgrade. I have no specific suggestions to offer, though, in the stated price range.

A probably unnecessary reminder, also, that efficiency and intrinsic sonic quality are not all that have to be considered. Ideally impedance should be high, and should not dip down to low values at any frequency, and should not have severely capacitive phase angles (especially in the lower part of the spectrum where lots of energy is typically required, and especially at frequencies coinciding with impedance minima). And the less variation of impedance as a function of frequency the better. Speakers not meeting those criteria would not only entail increased risk of unsatisfactory results, but would tend to give results that are not even consistent among different SETs, due to differences in impedance interactions.

Just my $0.02. Best regards,
-- Al
If it were me, I would enjoy the De Capo speakers and save my $$ and in a few years take a look at Audio Note AN-e's. I did this. I waited until I could afford the E's. Before I got them I listened to them and am still in musical love four years later! Production model or the kit 3. The synergy with the Kit One amp would be excellent. Also looking at Coincident speakers would be a great option as well.
it might also turn out that there may be no need to look at other speakers since it may turn out that the Kit one/De Capo combo may be a long term satisfactory combo
Atmasphere:
Thanks a lot for the technical insights.

Charles:
Looking forward to hearing from you.

Almarg:
You always have so much to add to the conversation, thank you. Just to clarify, I do have some size flexibility here. I'm happy to move to a floor-stander and away from a stand-mount, which is why I'd look at Tekton Lore or one of the Omega floor-standers, which are rather boxy but not huge. My only real size limitation is that distance from the wall behind the speakers has its limits; I've only got about 1.5 to 2 feet to play with there.
As for lower end extension, my old Merlin TSM-mmi's were only rated down to 55 Hz, and I found them so lacking in punch and dynamics that I sold them after a couple of years. The De Capo's, rated down to 42 Hz, taught me that I needed a speaker to have at least a decent taste of low-end punch or I'll get bored and the music loses its foundation. Some of the candidates, like the Lore 2.0, are rated to extend quite lower than the De Capo - down to 30 Hz in the case of the Lore 2.0, which should be very satisfying in my room.

Jetrexpro,
Cooling it for awhile and saving up for AN speakers is also an option, certainly. I've only heard AN speakers at the California Audio Show but was extremely impressed with the demo at that time. Of course, Audio Note was fronting that system with multi-kilobuck AN electronics!
Look into Clayton Shaw's new line Spatial Audio. I have a
pair as well as my DIY Audio Nirvana offerings. Don't listen
to the " if you gonna go SET you need a super duper
ultra hi high efficient speaker crowd" With a 300B (6-9
watts) you'll be fine with 95 db up. Unless you like to
listen to above 96 dbs and if that's the case you don't need
a SET amp anyway!I would go with some sort of point source
system though.BTW, Charlesdad and Almarg are offering good
advise.