Why pay so much for super high end?


Most speakers costing $50,000+ use Seas, Scan Speak or Accuton.

In DIY forums most speakers designed use bargain drivers and usually are only 2.0 designs not bookshelf or center speakers to complete a surround system.

I’d love to have a Scan Speak 11 speaker system for atmos with 3 way bookshelves, center and floorstanders.

Why aren’t the designs out there and why are you guys pissing away all your money.

Personally I won’t get an upgrade from my speakers unless it’s of this caliber and neither can I afford nor want to donate money to these thieves.

A 3rd party 11 speaker atmos scan Speak system would be nice but I’m not spending $250,000.

Why on earth aren’t there designs out there for this and why do you all piss away your money?

I don’t get why hi fi isn’t all DIY even honest factory direct companies mark up 300%.

Unless you pull in $1+ million a year and don’t have any time I don’t get it.

Are you guys lazy?

Someone easily could design a great crossover and cabinets for everyone and the days of paying over $3,500 for a pair of loud speakers if you got some time or know a friend who could build cabinets would be over. I know of people who could design cabinets that rival $100,000 speakers and cost less than 1% than that.  Someone with some experience could easily design a diamond, beryllium and soft dome and various versions for various tastes.

I don’t get it. Speakers are so simple.  Crossovers cabinets and drivers.

You guys just throw your money away I don’t understand it why?


funaudiofun

Showing 8 responses by bo1972

The word ’highend’ is not based on parameters(as it should be). This means it it more based on price.

Does it garantee you a higher quality? No, it does not.

When people have no idea about how music sounds in real, you have no idea how you can create it.

When you are not able to understand what the properties are of each part in your set you don’t know why the sound and stage is what you hear.

Take a look at audio shows, distributers and shops. Most sets sounds poor, incomplete and are based on nothing. When you would have know the properties you would never have made the combination we are listening at.

In 2015 we visited the Munic Highend show. Over 90% were 2 dimensional demos. This means that the stage depth is between 0 and 1 metre maximum. This has nothing to do with highend audio.

No depth and maximum 1 metre is in real a hifi stereo parameter. But people use the word ’highend’ so they think will will believe it is highend.

The music they used was very poor in Munic. I asked many people what they were playing. Most didn’t know. So I asked; why would you play music you don’t know?

Audio and highend these days is more about surviving and money. And what it creates is that customers get less for their money.

Take a look at reviews and most do not give you a view of the ’real’ quality. Reviews have a big influence on what people buy. These days you can buy reviews.

You can ask yourself: What do you want to hear? The truth or the thing you would like to hear......

Music is all about emotion. The emotion is inside the music. You need to understand how the emotion works of us humans. Take a look again at audio shows, shops, distributers and manufacturers and you see that most demos do have diversity at all.

Diversity in sound is the main part to create and feel emotion. In the last big audio show we visited, all sets had almost no diversity. Here you see is that people have no idea how to create it.

There are always people who have the money to spend a lot of money on audio. Wheter they are rich or are prepared to pay it. But you can ask the question if they get value for the money they spend?

Each ’highend’ product what only can create a 2 dimensional stage will never be able to satisfy a person for a longer period of time. This is based on our emotion.

When there is almost no depth the distance between you and the music is bigger. It feels more from a distance. I have spoken to many people in the last 2 years who spend a lot of money on audio and were not happy.

They had one thing in common; They all owned a 2 dimensional system.

For many people who work in audio or have knowledge and insight in audio know how important stage depth and width is. It sets instruments and voices free in space. And brings you closer to the music.

A 3 dimensional stage has a huge impact on how we humans experience music. Beside this diversity in sound is needed to create a higher level of emotion during listening to an audio system.

Highend with a 2 dimensional stage does not make sense at all. It does not give you a view of how music is being projected in real. The same when there is no diversity. Richness in sound does not garantee you emotion in music. When the whole frequency has rather the same kind of sound, there is still no diversity.

Because diversity creates the most emotional feeling during listening.

I think ’highend’ needs to be judged on ’real’ parameters. This is the only way to give people an honest idea if it is highend or not.

Highend should be based on a quality. In real it is more based on the price. Money does not garantee you a higher quality.


Till 2010 most tests I did were in stereo. But in 2010 I started with acoustic measurement. And also tests in surround.

We use Audyssey, but at a totally different way then how Audyssey uses it. Because they make different mistakes in their way of measuring.

They do have little knowledge in how instruments and voices sound and how they are projected in real. 

When you do a measurement with Audyssey you can create a better balance  with all the speakers togheter. But there are still many mistakes they made.

I work with professional lasers, at 0.5mm precision and we measure at a totally different way. The results are superior in each single aspect you judge sound for.

We call it Statement Audio Pro measurement. In both stereo and surround it is a satement. Because the level in realism and details is so much higher than any level in sound possible.

It will bring surround and cinemas to a much higher level. Most speakers in cinemas are 2 dimensional, like the amps they are using are 2 dimensional.

They call Auro 3D and Dolby Atmos 3D. It has nothing to do with 3 dimensional sound. During a show of Auro 3D I explained the Auro people that they gave a 2 dimensional demo. When I explained it in details they understood.

When a speaker and amp cannot create stagte depth and width, the sound is still 2D. When you use hight speskers this will not change it.

By using lasers and measuring much more precise I created stealth low freqency. This means that the subwoofer is in phase with the speakers and the energy is exactly were it is of the recording.

Statement Audio Pro is the only reason why I and many of my clients got interested in surround. Without S.A.P.-measurement surround can be very exhausting. This is based on the unbalance in sound.

Audio in both stereo and surround need to be used based on properties. This creates a superior level in sound and emotion. Most systems are 2 dimensional, no single person in the world will be satisfied with any kind of 2 dimensional sound after time. This is based on our emotion.


People forget that when a speaker can start at let's say; 20hz, it only can reach this at a very high level of volume.

When you don't play loud, it will never reach 20hz even if a speaker is able to go this low.

When you use a subwoofer, it is possible to reach a much lower frequency at a lower volume level.
It can be proven with measuring, it is not that difficult......

You really think the speaker starts at 20hz at very low volume?
With S.A.P.-measurement I can get a subwoofer in phase with the speaker. But it is even more than that. You can use it to a much higher frequency. The energy is so much more perceivable.

I auditoned many big speakers in my life, when you play at low volume you miss the realism in the low frequencies. That is why they often play loud.

With a subwoofer with S.A.P. you go to u much higher level of realism. The energy of a double bass is not only what becomes fully free from the speakers. It is of each string you can feel the energy.

This level we never auditioned even with sets of over 500.000 euro. It is not about the money. It is being created by accuracy and timing.

My Pl-500 starts at 22hz, but with a PLW-15 (16hz) with S.A.P.-measurment you go to a different level and league in sound realism.

When I listen full range to my Pl-500 (8ohm) and my Pass (700 watts by 8ohm) you never will reach the level in realism in the lowest octaves. Especially at low freq. These days I seldom sell stereo without a subwoofer with S.A.P.

By using professional lasers and working at 0.5mm precision you reach a new level in timing and integration. Even in height the energy differs a lot more.

The stunning part of the Pl-500 is the diversity in the whole frequency. We compared it with the Wilson Audio Sasha. It was not a match, it outperforms it in each part. I hope to arrange blind shootouts in 2017 with many highend loudspeakers. Audio is all about shootout and may the best win.

When you listen your beloved music and instruments are played at the right height it brings you into another league. This league was not there with the Sasha. With the other Wilson Audio demos showed us the same level of diversity in height. It was very limited.

We have plans of giving demos using a big curtain. And also using conservatory students. The reason is that in real I can let people hear diversity and intimate focus of an instrument and voice.

In the last 6 months I have done a lot of research in diversity in sound. Now I can create a much higher level of diversity in the whole frequency response. Beside this we can create a stunning level in intimate sound with the best blacklevel you ever auditioned.




I am working in this world for over 18 years of time now. In the last 2 years I have spoken to many people who spend a lof of money on audio for a long time.

I wanted to know how it is possible they buy expensive stuff and some time later they don’t like it anymore.

Why you bought it?

I met a few people who had sets of about 80.000 euro and were not happy with their set and still trying to find the sound they were looking for.

They all had one thing in common. They bought parts which costed a lot of money. But at the end they didn’t like it.

They all gave the same answer why they bought it. They were busy for a long time and were tired of trying things out.

The second reason was that they believed the people who sold it to them. It takes some time and then it will sound good they told them.

Mannnnn how naive you can be? Things need time to burn in, but when it does not convince don’t buy it.

I met people who were so tired that they wanted to sell their whole system. When I saw what they bought it was very easily for me why it sounded like shit.

When you are not able to think in properties audio is one big F. gamling. Nothing more, nothing less. You need to understand why the stage and sound is what you hear.

If you cannot answer this question, audio is all about trial and error. There is no discussion possible.

Each system what only playes a 2 dimensional stage has nothing to do with highend audio. Because when you listen to music in real it has it’s place in space.

Most 2 dimensional systems play all instruments and voices on one line. The problem is based on the human emotion. Each single 2 dimensional system is not able to create enough intensity and emotion to be liked over a longer period.

All the people who didn’t buy music anymore, or didn’t like their system anymore had the same thing in common. They all owned 2 dimensional systems.
Dome tweeters are of of those parts which does not make sense at the time we live. Based on their limitations why you would still use them.

At shops, shows, distributers and people at home they still make a lot of mistakes regardless what kind of stuff you connect with it.

With the expensive Sonus Faber, B&W 800D3 series, Kef reference. Kef Blade, Focal Utopia and Wilson Audio showed at many sets the same kind of difficulties over and over again.

Sss, sharp edges, word endings which are not pronounced well. Also the limitation in diversity in heights of recordings. Narrow staging and not a sharp individual focus of voices and instruments.

These are essential parts of highend which need to be there.

When there would be parameters, many highend speakers who use the word ’highend’ would never be called highend.

Magico uses some nice materials. But they have their own limitation as well. You can make a cabinet without any kind of resonations, it will not be the best sounding speaker.

They get a clean sound, and even with tubes you still hear back the clean sound. Creating speakers by computers and measurements will not create the best and most involving speaker.

Sonus Faber had once a great article about instruments. Like a violin or cello creates it’s sound and diversity by distortion. When you listen to many highend systems these days often they miss diversity in sound.

This is by far the most important part to create emotion for us humans. When we go to a show and we speak with many different people about the sets. Most discussions are these days about the lack of emotion in the sets on shows.

It is a fact that many sets are not able to create diversity. The thing is; they don’t know how to create it?

Highend without a 3 dimensional physical stage has nothing to do with highend audio. When you go to the biggest highend show in the world in Munic and 90% is 2 dimensional you can ask yourself if people understand what they are doing. And why the stage and sound of their system is what we hear?

Even expensive audio does not garantie you a higher quality or a physical 3 dimensional image as it should be. The reason why is very simple.

There are no parameters and rules for highend audio. It is word without a true  meaning.
Audio is not about how much money you can spend. Or are prepared to spend.

It is a fact that you need to pay a lot more to get double the quality. Still this is not the problem or limitation.

People who work in audio need to be more open and honest to give people more quality for the money they want to spend. It is too easy to be focussed just on your own F. needs.

Live is all about looking further. And in audio you also need to learn to look further. Differences are in the details.

Without music there is no audio. But without audio there is still music. People who work in audio need to learn to have more respect for music.

When they would have more knowledge and insight in music they would create different and better products. There are a lot of products which properties and qualtities has nothing to do with how music sounds.

When people have no idea how music sounds in real, you can say and sell them whatever you want. Based on time and techniques people could get a lot more in quality than what they get back.