Garaneau, I just ordered a set and yes Best Tronics wires them exactly the same as Day/Yazaki. Shield soldered to ground on both ends. |
I hidden gem can be found with Amadi cables. Simply outstanding. |
Where do we buy the WE 16 ga wire? In what ways did the Belden and Sablon sound different. Which one was more natural and easy to listen to? |
I purchased from that eBay seller and we will see on the speaker cables. Are you guys terminating or just hooking it up bare wire? I am thinking of going bare wire since it is tinned. |
I needed a longer set of speaker cables and received 28 feet of the WE16 GA today. I made a set of cables with bare wire connections on both ends.
I have had them playing for 4 hours now. They replaced very highly regarded $1500 cables. Thus far I am very impressed with the WE16. Not as detailed or an image champ like my other cables, but these have a very special relaxed and inviting sound. No glare at all.....none of that digital glare or forced highs. None! Very smoooooth!
Just easy to listen to and quite engaging in an unforced and inviting way. Some may find them a tad to mellow if they like silvery highs and a more upfront sound.
I will let them settle in more. |
They have changed already and are a tad sharper sounding......not quite as smooth, but more detail and better imaging. Hope I get back that smoothness however. I will update as they burn in running 24/7. |
Well the WE16 ga has now been playing over 70 hours and sounding very good indeed. I can find no fault. $1.39 per foot and no terminations needed! |
I should also mention the wire is no longer too tame or mellow. It is very dynamic and resolved after break-in. As alive and resolved as my past set of expensive and nice pure silver cables. |
Mitch2
I have more wire here I am going to try a double run on each leg to compare to one. Simple to do and I am now quite familiar with the sound of just one run.
This wire does become quite a bit more lively in the top end after 50 hours or so of burn in. I actually liked the initial more mellow highs better. They are still quite good however. Wonder if more gauge on the bass will help give more bottom end to match the mids and highs livlyness. No doubt more hours have changed the wire in the upper mids and highs. |
Mitch2 can you provide a link showing the braid method you are going to use? Thanks! |
I now have two runs per pole of the WE wire. I twisted them and put a nice black Tech Flex netting over them. I found one run to sound very good. With burn in however they were a little, just a little , too tilted up in the highs after 50 hours or so. My system is very resolving however so any small change is quickly revealed.
I found two runs provided more base weight and improved overall body and tonal balance. I will report back after the second set has burned in for 50 hours. Thus far a nice improvement in my system vs. just one run of the WE wire. |
Maxima95, that is exactly what I did. The improvement is slight and huge. I do like it better however with two runs. Very direct sounding wire and quite lively. |
Meant to type slight and not huge...... |
Metman, Mikirob is spot on. You must get the Belden ICs in combo with the WE as they are magic together and any hint of that brightness is gone. I agree 100% with your comments on the WE16, but when the IC was added all was perfect. |
The Belden wire starts off bright and within just 20 hours becomes natural sounding and quite nice to listen to. Don't let the initial brightness disturb you. It greatly concerned me at first, but quickly went away. The difference is pretty big on the Belden and far less so with the WE wire. |
Jet, hate to say it but two runs per leg sound much better based on my experience. More body, weight and fullness. Need to double up! Sorry. |
Forget my last response. You got it covered....my bad. |
Hi Jet. I had the same experience with the Belden at first. I found they really settled down and became quite natural sounding after more break in. They seemed to mate well with the WE wire in my system. System synergy is most important however.
That WE wire is very special and at under $1.50 foot a great find. This weekend I am going to wire my preamp with it. I already have it in my amp and dac. |
I also love the aroma of the WE wire. I to love the smell of old vinyl and NOS parts! |
I use the WE wire on the RCA inputs and the outputs and from the output trannys to the binding posts. In my dac and pre I use it on the RCA inputs/outputs, digital in on the dac etc...
All signal wires I can possibly use it! I have not used it for high voltage as it is rated for 300 volts and cloth wrapped. |
Maybe I will build a set. Not a bad idea? |
Yes, Jupiter copper foils are the first choice followed by Jupiter flat stacked aluminum caps. The latter is warmer and not as resolving, but very organic and full of body and weight. These are much less expensive. The copper foil Jupiter are more resolving and pure. They are more money, but not near the price of the great Duelund caps. |
Be sure to get 20% off these caps by buying from Sonic Craft as they usually offer that or you can ask. If your speaker has any resistors, then get Path Audio resistors from Parts Connextion. They are simply the best I have heard, even better than Duelund or Mills etc.... |
Mitch2, just wait to they burn in more and stay put and settle into your system. You have only a taste of what is coming. I replaced Jupiter solid core copper in cotton inside my speaker with WE and wow! |
I know. I had to discard all of my previous knowledge, experience and assumptions with this magic wire. |
But the best part is still ahead of you. The Belden ic matched with this WE wire takes it up to a whole new realm. The combo is unbeatable and unmatched in my experience as well as the experience of many others. |
Mitch2, I am an avid DIY builder with gear and wire. I know you want to use the better connectors, I get it, but please use the same Switchcraft connectors that usually come with these Use the same exact build, connecting the shield on both ends etc...
This stuff is magic as is and proven. "Better" connectors will not necessarily equal better sound. We have a proven recipe here that is so special.
The WE wire sounds better without spades....just bare wire. I tried both. If you must use connectors, then I fully understand. They still sound wonderful with them as you know.
The Belden cable with the Switchcraft connectors just plain works. Major Mojo stuff here! Like tomato and bacon! Like bacon and eggs! Like bacon and anything really.... |
Well an update on the mighty Belden cable with Switchcraft connectors used as a digital cable. The cable only has 10 hours on it thus far. It replaced an outstanding Sablon Audio Panatela pure silver twisted wire digital cable in natural fibers. I purchased it used from a Six Moons reviewer. He used it as his reference for several years. This Sablon cable is outstanding and made my Yamamoto dac really sing compared to other digital cables.
With only 10 hours the $30 Belden is no slouch already. The stage grew wider and taller. The sound is more full bodied and meaty. The music sounds more natural and flowing. The detail retrieval is not quite as good just yet, but we will see after some 50-100 hours. If it continues to open up like my last two sets of BeldenICs, then the mighty Sablon will find a new home.
I find the Belden cable so beautiful sounding. They make the music flow with a musical ease and smoothness that escapes most big dollar cables. They do sound a little muddy at first in the mid to lower bass, but that also resolves itself after full burn in.
Glare. I hate it. Glare is something the Belden cable seems to hate more than I. It is not there....smooooooth! |
Mitch2, understand your thoughts but simply want to point out all connectors have a sound. I don't use binding post either as they also hurt the sound. I just use them as a clamp to hold the wires. That is the best connection. |
I have not tried the WE wire for IC's, but may well do that. I bet they would have the same great bass as they do when used for speaker cables. |
Al, help me with your last post. My current Sablon is 75 ohm and this sounds better thus far. 52 ohm vs 75? Not much difference and you seem to be saying it is a poor match! |
Meant to say the Belden sounds better..... |
Well said Al and the explaination was perfect! I will compare the 52 ohm Belden to the 75 ohm Sablon once the Belden has more time on it.
I did notice a slight loss of detail initially and perhaps this is the reason. I had assumed it was due to lack of burn in, but we will see. |
Sorry Richard as I just saw this after reading your Agon email. All 4 wires are in one Tech flex netting per side. I twisted two positive WE runs and then separately twisted two negative WE runs. I then twisted the double runs and placed in Tech Flex netting. The final twisting of the two double runs was not tight at all, but just enough to keep the entire cable together. |
Well Al, Rob and others here is an update on the Belden as a digital cable. After 124 hours of burn in the Belden is very good. The Sablon and Belden are very, very close in my particular rig. I would say the Sablon has a tad more upper end air...just a tad. I would say the Belden is more natural and organic sounding with a larger stage. It seems to be a tad more natural sounding and inviting if you will. So yes the Belden makes a great digital cable after full burn in. It sounds muddy and a little closed in and dull at first. Give it time and you will be pleased. At $30 you you be very, very pleased.
My system is very revealing and my Raal tweeters seem to be a good match with the Belden cable. Your system may yield a different result. I like it a lot.
Some may like the Sablon better in my system as it really depends on your sonic preference. Both are very good for sure. I suppose in Aphile terms and on great recordings Sablon is the winner. There is just something about the Belden that works for me across a wider array of recordings. |
Great. I am very interested in this! |
Jet, let me know your build recipe please. Did you shield etc.... |
The 16 is just proven, tested and recommended. The 14 may be fine, but it is new territory. The 16 is special as used in the above posts! I have it everywhere now. Inside speakers, crossovers, and all electronics. |
I do have a friend that tried the solid core and then tried the stranded we are all talking about. He liked the solid core, but preferred the stranded. The stranded 16 is just proven, tested and works across a myriad of different systems. |
I see why you are asking about the 14 gauge as it seems he is out of the 16 to purchase by the foot. I understand the stranded 14 is the very same wire and outer wrap.....just thicker gauge. Don't know if it will sound any different. |
My system is as resolving as any. I still say to use 16 gauge period. I cannot confirm what some are hearing, but keeping it simple is best and proven. All other combinations are new and trial and error. The 16 gauge is as resolving as any cable in my system. In fact more so than many expensive silver and copper cables I have owned from Kimber, MG Audio, Sablon Audio etc...
System synergy is always important and may well be the difference in some systems. |
I need to also say the WE wire is the opposite of rolled off and thick in my system....completely opposite. Too much wire may in fact lead to this phenomenon in a particular system. The 16 gauge wire is shockingly clean and real sounding delivering more resolution then my system has ever experienced.
I have had friends try all kinds of the WE wire and not follow the proven recipe. Solid core, thicker gauge, silk cover etc... When they finally tried the stranded 16, they stayed with it.
Rob and I post here to try and help others with this wonderful find. Yes, I get frustrated when folks try something else not proven. This is one time to not over think and just enjoy.
I am not saying don't experiment, but start off with the proven and then go for it! |
The Belden cable is certainly more subdued in the highs compared to the extended WE. Some will certainly find the Belden a tad soft in the highs. |
Jet, I need to hear from you sooner! Ha! I want to build a set, but am waiting on your initial impressions. |
I will build a set just like the Belden using the WE wire and report back. I will use the 3502aau Switchcraft connectors, tinned copper shielding braid connected at both ends. I will twist the wires. I want to replicate the Belden cable using WE wire. |
I am building the IC's based on the proven wire:) I tried the solid core for speaker cables and not as good. Loss of the musicality we all love. Perhaps more aphile top end extension, but at sonic cost! |
The others will like/love the wire with more burn in folks. They have not heard it yet...period. The wire needs 100 hours to settle in. This wire IS as universal as it gets and all will at least like to love it WITH THE PROPER RUN IN TIME.
If you don't, then you have purchased the wrong wire or like to spend money :) Kind of a joke, well kind of..... |
Brownsfan, hope it works out! I cannot vouch on the sound of the 14ga as I have mentioned before. I can tell you the 16ga is as good as wire gets after burn in. I just don't know what a thicker and different birth date means in terms of sound vs. the 16 ga. |
Rob, I had a Lampizator 4/4 with Duelund caps on the input and outputs. The Yamamoto is better after two simple mods. I found the Lampi to be very good, but in the end, not as musical and engaging. Based on your sonic preferences I am quite sure the Yami is better for you than the Lampi. |
Rob,
Output Cap change, WE wire on the inputs and outputs and a nice upgraded fuse. The Lampi was more forced sounding and upfront if you will. It did not let the music come to me, but rather shot it out at me. The Yami lets the music flow with an addictive ease I bet many highly touted $10,000 dacs can't touch. I like the intimacy of the Yami. The Yami sounds like a great SET amp, while the Lampi sounded more like a powerful tube push/pull amp. Trying to help you better understand the differences Rob. |
