Hjghly detailed systems for me lose out in musicality. It is less natural. It might be that at home we got used to certain sound, that is different from live performance and we follow it? Perhaps we also try to compensate for music compression by adding some noise or distortion (as distorted guitar is more dynamic than clean Jazz guitar at the same level). I'm trying to get clean reproduction (accuracy), but if sound even with added distortion, noise and harmonics sounds natural/musical then it has fidelity. Fidelity is not accuracy - cannot be measured, being subjective. |
2nd order harmonics is not distortion, 5th order harmonics is.
Anything added is distortion. Piano, for instance, has overtones stretched over harmonics. Octave higher key is not tuned to double frequency but to overtone of the lower octave key (otherwise keys would beat). Tuning person is winding strings up until beat stops. Because of that piano has accumulated error of about 30 cents at both ends of the keyboard. Playing piano thru amplifier that adds second harmonic, is creating beats - exactly against tuning to avoid it . With overly warm gear piano can sound even like out of tune. |
I prefer an amp that adds 5% 2nd order harmonics over one which adds 0.01% 5th order harmonics. I prefer amplifier that does not add any distortion. My Benchmark AHB2 has THD=0.00011% (-119dB, inaudible). Any distortion is coloring sound (reducing clarity). One might prefer to look at the paintings thru yellow glasses. There is nothing wrong with it, but he doesn't see what artist painted. |
Colours would be visible fundamental wavelengths/frequencies. Not harmonics of the fundamental.
We’re not talking about harmonics in the recorded music, but harmonics added where they did not exist at all. Adding harmonics to piano, that are different than piano overtones, is distorting piano sound (creating beats). You might like it, but it is distorted sound with reduced clarity. Trying to cover bright metal dome tweeter with warm sounding gear is adding further reduction in clarity. Now, we have both odd and even harmonics added, when replacing tweeter (or speakers) seems to be the better choice, at least to me. |
No, you actually prefer an amp that adds distortion, and your benchmark reduces clarity.
This is not true. Our hearing evolved over millennia to interpret the fundamental frequency and even ordered harmonics as natural and clear sound. There is no natural sound in nature that is not accompanied by even ordered harmonics. Not true as well. Piano does not have harmonics at all. It has overtones that are at different frequencies than harmonics. Clarinet has only odd order harmonics (acting like close tube resonator). Pure sine wave doesn't have any harmonics, etc. It is obvious that unique sound of (odd harmonics only) Clarinet will be altered when system adds even harmonics. The 0.00011% THD is achieved by dialing in large amounts of NFB. NFB results in odd ordered harmonics
Not true. It results in odd harmonics (TIM distortions) only if NFB is recursive. AHB2 uses non-recursive feedback. Signal fed back does not come to the input section of the amplifier, but to completely different error amplifier, that runs in parallel. Even in minute amounts, odd ordered harmonics sound unnatural, sterile and not musical. Odd ordered harmonics do not occur naturally. This is wrong. Where you learning this ??? Almost all instruments (with few exceptions), produce series of even and odd harmonics. Odd harmonics do not occur naturally ??? What about Clarinet that has only odd harmonics? |
It moves or it doesn’t? We’re trying to find out why it is moving or not otherwise what is the sense in participating here. Many people believe that warm sounding gear "moves" them, while natural clean sounding gear sounds analytic, sterile etc. Read AHB2 opinion I found long time ago:
"In my 25 years of of experience with mostly tube amplifiers of all sorts, I have never come across a more emotionally involving amplifier than the AHB2. It is exactly because it doesn’t "interpret" the music by adding coloration or any artificial sense of ambience or reverberation that it is so fascinating to listen to. The AHB2’s ability to reproduce the timbre and texture of acoustic instruments is beyond anything I have experienced before - just listen to brass or woodwind! - and the precision with which it reveals the actual acoustic properties of the recording venue, whether it be a small café or a concert hall, is second to none. At least to my ears. I think what captured my attention from the very first instant was how honest and genuine the sound is. If it is in the recording, it is there, otherwise not.
This amplifier keeps me on the edge of my seat in excitement and anticipation even with recordings that I have known for years and not thought very highly of, so in my view it is the very antithesis of boring. I don’t remember having ever been so moved by reproduced music as with this Benchmark combo. FYI, I almost exclusively listen to classical music and much of it in hi-rez, but I have to say that well-recorded CDs are also much more enjoyable and listenable now than before.
Karsten" |
Here is conclusion from Absolute Sound review of AHB2, but it applies to subject discussed here:
"Because accuracy allied to absolutely reliable performance is the goal of all the Benchmarks, they are not products that tend to attract cults or other sorts of starry-eyed enthusiasts, wholly lacking any of the quirks, foibles, idiosyncrasies, sonic flavorings, euphonic distortions, and so on that characterize the objects of most audio cults. Professionals buy Benchmark because they know the products work and are reliable and accurate—indeed, reference caliber. Music lovers buy them because they are neutral and accurate and thus reproduce the tonal character of voices and instruments correctly (and also, I presume, because they are reasonably priced, most musicians, like most other people, being typically not wealthy). But audiophiles? Well, the longer I’m in this racket, the less I sometimes think I understand what audiophiles really want except that a lot of dallying about with components, equipment swapping, and coloration matching seems to be what amuses them. I’m not sure I can in good conscience recommend this amplifier to them as I am not sure they are in search of what it offers: a precision instrument designed to perform the precisely defined task of reproducing music and sound accurately, which it does essentially to perfection. But to anyone else, the AHB2 gets as high, enthusiastic, and confident a thumbs up as my arm is capable of reaching."
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Lemonhaze It is not about "My Benchmark" but rather about idea we are discussing. It could be any other amp of similar character. I hope you understand it.
Let's summarize what you said:
You don't like very detailed sound
You don't like perfect imaging
You like coloring of the sound by overly warm 300B
You're perfect representation of what Absolute Sound review, I quoted, was talking about. You have great future on this forum. |
So now douglas_schroder found the Benchmark amplifier to occupy the "clean/sterile" (White sounding?) end of the sonic spectrum. but in his review he says: The sound is indeed neutral and exact without being sterile or clinical. Colorless? Not really. The amp will send through the sound palette of the source component and disc/file without stripping any color away. Absolute Sound reviewer was condescending? Perhaps, but I feel the same way when people tell me, that odd harmonics are unnatural, that amount of details should be limited and imaging shouldn't be exact - just because neither is perfect in live performance. So, If venue has bad acoustics I should look for bad sounding dull CD to replicate it? In addition it was stated that high resolution is only good for classical music. Amount of detail is usually increased with pronounced high frequencies, that also reveal harshness/brightness caused by noise or distortion. Instead of fixing the problem many audiophiles cover it with "warm" sounding gear, producing even harmonics - a distortion that alters real sound of instruments. "Warmth" is considered a virtue by many who constantly praise it. Hard to argue with that - after all it is a matter of taste and what sounds right is OK, but it is not what I'm looking for. I'm looking for accurate uncolored reproduction of music and the ways to achieve it. It appears I will not find it here and this forum is not for me. |
