Charles1dad, you cleared it up all the way and I'm with you. The fact that we are all "audiophile's" and have rigs that add so much to the music we heard ages ago is icing on the cake.
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Rok2id, your question "Should we include the girl singers", just soaked in. Absolutely!
Nina Simone was forced to become a singer. She was playing piano at a lounge to pay for her education as a classical pianist, when the owner told her to sing. The rest is history.
That chick can really bang on the keys. Her early albums always included a couple of instrumentals. She has a style minutely reminiscent of Bud Powell, but it's uniquely "Nina Simone" one of a kind style. Sometime I single out all of her instrumentals, and just put them on my play-list.
Back to "Donald Byrd", check "Here Am I" and tell me what you think about Pepper Adams on Baritone sax?
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This is the first time I heard "Harlem Blues". I will definitely add it to my collection. I don't blame you for being out of the vinyl business, it's quite expensive when you're talking about better than CD.
I think the term "jazz giant" between the two of us is a matter of semantics, or maybe we could have more than one list.
Donald Byrd has put out such a wide range of fantastic jazz, that it's almost impossible to say, "I like jazz, but I don't care for Donald Byrd". When I see a statement like that, I know that it's because they haven't heard everything that Byrd's put out.
The records I suggested by Byrd represent different stages of his career, sample them and tell me what you think.
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Foster_9, after your welcome, this is like being back among old friends who are all "jazz aficionado's".
While I know a lot about jazz, I learn a lot every time I post. Now that we have "youtube", it's unnecessary to buy the record or CD before you know whether or not you like it.
The music from "Places and Spaces", as well as "Harlem River Drive", was when Donald was in a "funky, street groove" as opposed to a "deep in the jazz pocket groove". Donald Byrd covered all the grooves when it came to soulful music.
It feels good to be back, and I always look forward to your posts.
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Charles1dad, ages ago, I would argue whether or not this artist, or that artist was the best on his chosen instrument, and I would argue my point till the cows came home. Since we were in the city, the cows never came home.
Now, as far as I'm concerned, it's the same as debating which is the best color, orange or blue? Is Lee Morgan better than Donald Byrd? I'm sure he is if we compare one unique aspect of Lee Morgan's playing with that same aspect of Donald Byrd's playing.
I don't listen like that, nor do I hear like that. When I listen to Lee Morgan, I'm in a jazz lovers paradise. When I listen to Donald Byrd, I'm in paradise still, although it's a bit different from the one I left with Lee Morgan.
Is orange better than blue? Orange is a very beautiful color when I'm looking at orange, but so is blue when I'm looking at blue.
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Rockadanny, I can certainly respect your preference for Byrd as a sideman, instead of a leader. I just double checked my collection of LP's and CD's that feature Byrd as a "sideman".
He appeared with "Kenny Clark", on Bohemia After Dark;"Art Blakey", The Jazz Messengers; "Gene Ammons", Jammin With Gene; "Horace Silver", Six Pieces of Silver; "Sonny Clark", Sonny's Crib; "Pepper Adams", Out of this World; and "Hank Mobley", No Room For Squares. These are just the one's I have, he appears on many more as a sideman. Every last one of those albums consists of "deep in the pocket, heavy hitting jazz jams", while Donald Byrd also went into funk and soul as a leader.
I can see how the truest "connoisseurs" of jazz would make a statement such as yours.
Enjoy the music, it's all good.
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Rok2id, I'm glad you brought in the girl singers, this conversation would be incomplete without them. But you left one out that deserves to be ranked alongside the one's you mentioned, and to be placed in the company of those ladies is the highest of honors for a girl jazz singer.
Anita O'Day is one of the "jazziest" girl singers. Check her out on youtube at the Newport Jazz Festival singing "sweet Georgia Brown". I've never liked that song, but when Anita sung it at Newport, it was too hip for words, even the way she moved was jazzy.
A girl singer is known by the company she keeps. Duke Ellington, Oscar Peterson, Dizzy Gillespie, Miles Davis, Stan Getz, Gerry Mulligan, Coleman Hawkins, and Stan Kenton was some of the company Anita kept.
I like your list, and as I read it, I pictured that particular girl singing one of the tunes she was most famous for.
Conversations like this about the music I love, really makes my day, and I hope it makes yours to.
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Snakeyp, initially I was one of those purists who cried "foul, it ain't jazz". I went to the record store and bought a Donald Byrd LP, when I put it on and heard something different, "What's this"? If you went to the liquor store and bought what you thought was cognac, and tasted wine when you drank it, imagine your disappointment.
After I heard the same music much later, I accepted it for what it was "funk", now I'm a wine connoisseur. This is "social music", you can even dance to it. When Donald came out with this music, most of his fans were past that phase of their life. While hanging in the park groovin after dark, was a long ago memory, I could still relate to it, and I say to you "If grooving is your thing, then you and your sweet lady groove on".
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Rok and Charles, we are in total agreement in regard to the top 3 ladies. Carmen is my girl too, she sounds the most seductive.
I remember Clifford, he left us much too soon. "Sassy Swings Again" will be in my collection, "Sweet Georgia Brown" or not. Nancy is already well represented, including with Cannonball.
This is the best jazz discussion I've ever had here, keep it going.
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Rok, I just discovered a video cassette in my collection of "Sun Ra". The title is "A Joyful Noise", and it includes his band when they lived in the Germantown neighborhood of Philadelphia.
If you want to know more about "Sun Ra" and his music, I highly recommend "A Joyful Noise".
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Today, I'm very saddened at the loss of my old friend Donald Byrd. Although I never met him, through his music I felt like he was a personal friend. Me and Donald go all the way back to 1960 when I met him on "Fuego". Since that time, we've been together throughout his many styles and musical changes. I'm thankful that I have so much of his music to enjoy, and I'm glad that he left so much music for all of us to share and enjoy.
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Rok, I think your criticism and critique of Donald Bird are both accurate and concise. In regard to Pepper Adams and Gerry Mulligan, it's a case of orange or blue.
While both Adams and Mulligan have records I could live without, both have records I wouldn't want to live without. Since you already know about Adams, I'll touch upon Mulligan. On the movie sound track "I Want To Live", he's the primary artist and his brooding baritone sets the mood for the entire movie. This music is also an excellent example of "West Coast Jazz", which I thought was hip at the time, but it came and went. No aficionado's collection is complete without it, if for no more than to know what it is.
I stated "A food critic must sample many dishes before he knows which is best". This critic has sampled many dishes that belonged in the garbage, and that's where I'll leave them. In this stage and phase of our lives as "jazz aficionado's", it's time to focus on the best and forget about the rest, that eliminates tangents like "Sun Ra". Fortunately, "we" meaning those of us who are still posting, are fairly "sympatico" in regard to what's best.
Apparently most of the "aficionados" have gone elsewhere, consequently we're all that's left; therefore, this thread has officially become, "The best of the best and leave the rest".
HAPPY TURKEY DAY TO ALL.
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Paul Chambers Quintet: When I listen to jazz, I try to take my mind back to when the record was made. This was cut in the late 50's, and that's when "West Coast jazz" was hip. This music has a west coast jazz feel to it.
The Sound of Jazz: was the most impressive thing I've ever seen on TV about jazz. When I looked at Billie Holiday singing "Fine and Mellow", it brought tears to my eyes; that's because I know her life story, and I could feel it when she sang.
Gerry Mulligan on baritone is standing next to Coleman Hawkins, and they're both blowing for "Lady Day". She's listening, and you can tell by that expression of total inner contentment on her face that she's really digin it.
Wes Montgomery: "Bumpin On Sunset" takes me back to another time and place; back to beautiful ladies and swinging lounges where they were dancing to "The Philly Dog". The music you chose was before that time, it was before he became famous. "Around Midnight", from "The Wes Montgomery Trio" is my favorite version. It's the one with the album cover on "youtube". While there is a difference in his music between this time and that time, I like both times for different reasons. The music he made, that made him famous, conjures up visions; while the music he made before then is his best jazz, and is the most listenable.
Today, I'm into Yusef Lateef. Although he's been widely used as a sideman, I prefer the albums he's led. Right now I'm listening to "The Blue Yusef Lateef"; this album covers a lot of musical territory.
The way we're going now, is the way I think this thread should proceed.
Enjoy the music. |
Charles1dad, I hope we haven't lost you. Your contributions were important and very much appreciated. |
Rok, they're already gone. While you've recommended some fantastic music that I've added to my collection, it's all old. Fortunately for us, Donald left so much good jazz, that as much as I have, I'm sure there are gems of his I don't have. When I acquire them, It'll be like meeting Donald all over again.
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