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How do you judge your system's neutrality?


Here’s an answer I’ve been kicking around: Your system is becoming more neutral whenever you change a system element (component, cable, room treatment, etc.) and you get the following results:

(1) Individual pieces of music sound more unique.
(2) Your music collection sounds more diverse.

This theory occurred to me one day when I changed amps and noticed that the timbres of instruments were suddenly more distinct from one another. With the old amp, all instruments seemed to have a common harmonic element (the signature of the amp?!). With the new amp, individual instrument timbres sounded more unique and the range of instrument timbres sounded more diverse. I went on to notice that whole songs (and even whole albums) sounded more unique, and that my music collection, taken as a whole, sounded more diverse.

That led me to the following idea: If, after changing a system element, (1) individual pieces of music sound more unique, and (2) your music collection sounds more diverse, then your system is contributing less of its own signature to the music. And less signature means more neutral.

Thoughts?

P.S. This is only a way of judging the relative neutrality of a system. Judging the absolute neutrality of a system is a philosophical question for another day.

P.P.S. I don’t believe a system’s signature can be reduced to zero. But it doesn’t follow from that that differences in neutrality do not exist.

P.P.P.S. I’m not suggesting that neutrality is the most important goal in building an audio system, but in my experience, the changes that have resulted in greater neutrality (using the standard above) have also been the changes that resulted in more musical enjoyment.
bryoncunningham
csontos
1,311 posts
 
Easy. Soundsbeyondspecs is a dog!
tbg
5,263 posts
 
Soundsbeyondspecs, I think that speakers and electronics cause great variation in how limited the "sweet spot" is. My quest is a very wide, deep, and high the sound stage is as well as how precise. Doing what you need to do would mean that I have failed. Electrostats I have found have tiny sweet spots and mainly sound like you are not in the recording studio but rather in the control room listening through two windows to the recording studio.
csontos
1,311 posts
 
With all due respect, it is a ridiculous exercise imo since none of the gear is voiced in that manner while being designed. He's discovered a novelty all his own. My experience has been that however wide, deep, or high the sound stage is, the better the gear gets, the smaller the sweet spot is. But, the bigger the ballpark gets.
bifwynne
2,206 posts
 
About 2 months ago or so, I auditioned 2 speakers (call them Brand P and Brand X) at a dealer. Many members would probably say that Brand X was the better speaker hands down, and I respect personal opinions.

But here's what I found bizarre. The Brand X manufacturer must have had OCD because the dealer had to use a tape measure to measure off precise distances between the speakers, some kind of protractor to measure toe in, and back to the tape measure to place the listening chair just the right distance back from the speaker fronts.

Not done yet, the dealer had to use a bubble level to ensure the Brand X speakers were perfectly vertical. Why?? I have no idea. I suppose I could make a joke by saying that I had to place my head in a vice contraption to make sure I was facing the speakers just so and also use a bubble level to make sure my head was horizontally flat.

Well ... after all that, I listened to the Brand P speakers. This time no tape measures, bubble levels, head vices and so forth. Brand P was the better sounding speaker .... to my ears.

The point -- if my poor dealer friend had to go through this much trouble to get Brand X to sound just right, yet Brand P wiped the floor up with Brand X with no advance prep, what does this say about neutrality. I think a lot.

IMO, most equipment "presents" sound in a way that hopefully one will find musically enjoyable. I mean we're not listening to our rigs inside an anechoic chamber. So why can't we just accept the fact that we're listening to gear that has its own unique acoustic presentation in a room that colors the sound too. Isn't it enough that we can enjoy the musical experience. And if it sounds like the live thing ... great.

Just my opinion here.
csontos
1,311 posts
 
I don't think anyone will disagree with you. But if we really want to be honest, there is a level at which objectivity trumps the mainstay of this forum. Namely the politically charged subjective forces that protect the party line. I think if someone here declares that they prefer the sound of an old pair of B&W 801/802 over a pair of Magico Q7's, we can safely declare they are full of shit. As far as brand P vs. brand X goes, from your experience, I would say my statement is a reasonable facsimile.
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