Help me choose: Harbeth 30.2 or SHL5+ XD in a 10 x 13 feet room?


Hello everyone, 

Need some guidance on speaker selection. I am primarily targeting Harbeth. Open to others’ opinions. For this discussion appreciate experienced feedback on these two speakers. Sharing my room and audio setup details below.

Room:

Dimensions: 9.7 ft (W) × 12.5 ft (L)

Ceiling: Cathedral, 9.6 ft peak

Floor: Pergo Laminated, 5.5 x 9 ft rug in center only

Speakers: Tontrager Stand on bare floor, not rug

Front wall: LG G5 77" TV + Nakamichi Dragon Sounbar. Butcher Block Acoustics stands and rack. 

Rear wall: Window behind MLP, curtained. 

Listening distance: ~5 - 7 ft

 

My Audio SYSTEM:

Main speakers - to be determined. Need your opinion.

Amp: Synthesis A100 Titan (KT66, 100 W @ 6Ω)

DAC: Holo May KTE

Streamer: HiFi Rose RS130

Subwoofer: REL S/510 (planned)

Cables: Audio Note Lexus 96, DH Labs Air Matrix Cryo, Mirage USB

 

Taste in Music: Vocals, acoustic jazz, classical, opera, Tool/Dream Theater

 

Given the room volume is small,  does it make sense to go with M30.2 or M30.3 and pair it with REL S/510, or SHL5PLUS XD or XD2? Which speakers will be optimal for best outcomes? 90% of the time I listen to vocals, jazz, and Acoustics. 

Thanks in advance for your guidance. 

 

vzz1924

I've been working to sell off the final stock of Stirling Broadcast as the owner is suffering health issues and is in a care home now. I've got no financial interest in it though so if it loks like I am pushing stuff it is of no benefit to me, just hassle really....

We have been selling the last LS3/5as as version 3.2, which is basically the same as the 3 but the crossovers are built with Jantzen air coils and crosscaps instead of the inhouse versions from Elytone, for a very useful SQ improvement. And I have been selling the last of the AB-2 bass extenders, which turn the LS3/5as into a floor stander, with upgraded crossovers as the standard one uses an electrolytic cap plus small poly bypass which doesn't cut the mustard and compromises the band passed signal to the LS3/5as.

We are out of AB-2s apart from one 2nd hand set of matching LS3/5as and AB-2s that I am trying to push to a guy in the UK, but Graham Audio do a Sub 6 bass extender which is an expanded (bigger cabinet and bigger driver) version of an AB-2, and their anniversary model of their LS3/5a is likely to have a similar standard crossover (just not the thin wall cabinet). So that combo are likely to be somewhat similar - i.e. the very point source/out of the box presentation of the LS3/5a but improved to be a full range version.

So I sold a pair of v3.2 LS3/5as and the AB-2 bass extenders to a local customer that had a pair of Harbeth C7ES3s but wasn't qute happy with them (bass mostly). 

I first sent him some demo LS3/5as only, his comments were: 

"...I have now had a chance to listen to the speakers for a few days, then gone back to harbeths, and ls3/5s again to better understand their qualities.

They are fabulous, the insight into music without sounding harsh is magical! I have not heard anything like it. Much faster than Harbeths as well (possibly due to a smaller driver size?) - excellent foot taping groove - the bass is tighter and leaner. Very engaging holographic sound imaging - something I was after as well. They also seem to work well with the current Naim kit. So definitely tick a lot of boxes!

They sound is close to perfect, however, because of the driver size and physical size they do not fill the room as much as larger speakers. While I do not listen to music loud, and prefer speakers which do not need to be driven hard to sound best,  they can sound a bit congested with busier passages, at higher volumes in my room."

So then I sent him some standard AB-2s:

"You know I was amazed by the LS3/5as and I find the AB2&LS3/5av3.2 combination astonishing! There were three main areas I was looking to address: bass speed and texture (not necessarily the sheer amount of bass) and soundstage/imaging.  

They delivered in spades! This is all very subjective, of course, and subject to both equipment synergy and room acoustics and...
 
The bass blew me away; I cannot see how anyone would want more (perhaps in a bigger room?) but I feel the speakers would run out of steam before more bass would be needed. Speed, texture, depth, timbre, groove - just excellent!
 
The detail is mesmerising. We sat yesterday evening with my wife and went over some familiar tracks, and while she is not too fussed with the minutiae of sonic lingo, she could not stop listening, the music grabbed her attention and would not let go. I could certainly relate to that and that sort of engagement speaks volumes in my book. The separation, realism & detail, devoid of any sibilance, the space between instruments, the disappearance of the transducers in the soundstage  - it all boggles the mind, honestly. I explored some valve amplifiers a while back, in search of this "holographic" sonic imaging to no joy, and these delivered exactly what I was after. 
 
While I do not tend to get lyrical over hifi equipment, I feel like I ought to have shared these impressions with you - these absolutely deserve the praise!"

 

So I've now upgraded his AB-2s as well for more improvement, some to the bass quality must mostly to the soundstagng.

I have another customer in Newbury that has V3s and standard AB-2 and is very happy with them.

In his main room he also bought some Stirling Broadcast LS3/6s but has never been really happy with them, and he has now tried multiple expensive amplifiers with them to try and make it better - started with Sugden Masterclass, then bi-amped Chord Ultima monoblocks, now a 300B tube amp.

I visted him a couple of weeks ago and upgraded his LS3/5as to v3.2s and upgraded the AB-2s as well. 

How he is even more uphappy with the LS3/6s as the v3.2s/AB-2s are so good.

I asked him what he thought of them now and the upgrade - his somewhat cliched answer was:

"For the first time seemingly in ages I am enjoying my music. The crossovers are a sort of leapfrogging upgrade... massive. I am listening to something in tracks that I am hearing for the first time"

 

Now he is trialling some Graham Audio LS5/5s but also not happy with those. I asked him what he thought of the upgraded LS3/5as and AB-2s compared to the LS5/5s: 

"Just amazing, Massive soundstage... If you do a blind test people will say these are £20K plus. The holographic soundstage is evident, everything is in a 3D time space placement. The 5/5s are nowhere near"
 
So I would consider finding your local Graham Audio dealer and trying the anniversary LS3/5as and their Sub6s. You can always add subs if they don't quite fill they room, but it is not so easy going the other way.
 
I've got a REL S/2 supplementing my AB-2, which go to just past 40Hz, but actually I have been very immpressed with the little REL T-Zero mk3 that I have hooked up in the standard REL manner as it really seems easy to mesh it in with the AB-2s and it give a response down to 20Hz when dialled in with the crossover set low enough.
 
The Falcon LS3/5a, whilst good, is not really a substitute for these v3.2 - they both sound like an LS3/5a within their grade 2 monitor catagorisation, but multiple customers with both say the v3.2s are a fair bit better, and I am making the assumption that the annversary Grahams are similar. The Falcon Q7 seems to do a lot better in comparisons, and that is an LS/5a in a deeper box.

+1 @big_greg . The larger Harbeths are too much speaker for that small room, and the ES3's are a much better fit.  With a REL sub, you'll be getting the bass extension you're looking for.  Note that the S/510 is now discontinued and replaced by a newer model.

Another consideration.  Look at ATC speakers, consumer and professional.  The professionals are made for close listening obviously.  I have a consumer brand ATC SCM-40 and it is the most revealing speaker I have ever heard in my system.  Extremely impressed.  Get a small sub or a pair and this system will be awesome!  Good luck!   

The 30.2 or 30.3 (if you have the budget) hands down. Had them in a similar room size on Ton Trager Stands (the best stands for Harbeth to allow full cabinet resonance). Particularly excellent for vocals and jazz. The C7 .3 are a very good alternative if you want a bit more bass (but will loose the exceptional mid range that is second to none for the M30). I compared and got many feedback including two Harbeth retailers) on the SHL5+ and they would definitely not be my choice. Someone even offered me to trade one for one their SHL5+ for my 30.2 because he regretted selling his pair of M30.2 XD. My suggestion would be to get the 30.2 first and see if you want to add a sub later. Good luck and keep us posted.

Thank you. I connected with Harbeth and they suggested C7 or M30 as well. I am inclined to M30 given all the feedback and data. Would love to hear more experiences from the forum.