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Striking a balance between musicality and resolution

As my years and experience in this hobby continue to grow I notice a divergence between those seeking extreme resolution and detail from their music reproduction systems and those in search of maximum musicality.

In theory, high-end audio systems should provide more than garden variety stereo systems. In my view that means more detail and information should be heard from a high-end music reproduction system than one hears from ordinary HiFi stereo systems set ups. BUT is there such thing as too much resolution and detail in a stereo system’s sound presentation?

Some people feel that a less detailed presentation that is easier for your brain to process has better flow and provides more enjoyable listening.

So there is the dichotomy. Should one pay more to hear less? Can a frequency response performance that is curtailed at both frequency extremes be desired and praised?

Those that seek a “more musical” presentation usually point to their belief that that is how they hear live un-amplified acoustic music in the real world. In nature, high frequencies attenuate and decay with distance from the source and sound waves get absorbed, diffracted, reflected, and diffused by the environmental factors and landscapes; so they are not wrong in stating that in the real world the sound of music is less detailed and extended. The issue is that when we listen to our music reproduction systems at home we are not listening to live un-amplified music in a concert venue, but rather professionally produced audio recordings typically recorded with close-microphones techniques.

So the question is, do we want our systems to reproduce the sound on the commercial audio recordings accurately or does one want hear the sound the way one thinks that it should sound?

Lucky for me, I have enough systems at home that I have been able to design, set up, and tune them for different targeted resultant sound, sound presentation, and sound qualities. For instance, my OKTAN6 ultimate horn system is a dissecting microscope, my Pinnacle horn system aims at extreme musicality, and my WAAR reference system is a chameleon, which can be adjusted to sound exactly how you want it to sound in real-time.

My “test-bed” system takes on the sound character and sound qualities of the components in use and it is excellent for evaluating what new components have to offer or bring to the table in terms of sound qualities. But with the Acapella TW-1S ION plasma super-tweeters extending the high frequencies, the TBI Emperor subwoofers extending the low frequencies, and the highly detailed & nuanced Digital Audio Denmark AX24 DSD dac streaming HQPLAYER as the source, the “Test Bed” system is a highly resolving system.

As with everything else in life, is there a happy medium or compromise that gives you the best of those worlds? I believe that there is and that great music reproduction systems can be tuned to strike a balance between musicality and resolution. If one listens to the evolution of my OKTAN6 ultimate horn system for instance you can hear that the fine tuning is driving the sound in that direction.

So during last night’s listening session I adjusted the sound of my “Test Bed” system to a more musical sound presentation. The “Test Bed” system is always in flux so it allows me to experiment, explore, tweak, tune, and have fun with it.

Here is an audio recording from last night’s listening session that captures the revised sound presentation and conveys the sound qualities that exemplify a more organic sound versus a more delineated & resolved sound presentation:
 

The Way It Goes

 

carlos269
toddalin's avatar
toddalin
667 posts
 

@rauliruegas 

You are absolutely correct that different parts have a different sound, and while the Audyns work, they are certainly not the best "sounding" caps to my ears (bright with no heart/sole), even in the conjugate position.  But if you look at the schematic, you will see that every conjugate Audyn is paralleled with a vintage Sprague 441P.

When making one of the literally dozens of crossover modifications over time, I wanted to go from a 12 mfd to a 10 mfd.  I didn’t have a 10 mfd in Audyn, but I did have three vintage Spragues from a neighbor who passed away.  The cap was in parallel with other Audyns to make 72 mfd (rather than 74 mfd).  When I changed the  Audyn to the Sprague the change in "character" was instantly notable to me and I very much liked it.  Voices took on a more "human" sound.

I then went on-line and was able to find a few more of these 441P Spragues to parallel with the Audyns for use in the conjugate position on both the 2241 and 2251.

I also find the sound of the Mills resistors to be a bit better than the "regular" Dales on the Heils.  But the woofers need the higher power handling capacity of the Dales.  Note that all resistors are 1%.

Maybe not the high priced spread, but certainly appealing to my ears and budget.

rauliruegas
13,384 posts
 

@carlos269 : " So the question is, do we want our systems to reproduce the sound on the commercial audio recordings accurately or does one want hear the sound the way one thinks that it should sound? "

 

Ok,one way or the other you already made:

"component selections, room acoustic treatments, power conditioning, interconnection cables selection, grounding, shielding, mechanical coupling, mechanical isolation, and so on..."

 

as all of us. You can’t be different because you need electronics, cables, room and the like as every one.

 

"  want hear the sound the way one thinks that it should sound?

that’s why we fine tunning the room/system with out " touch the signal " when you do it and when you " touch " that recording signal you develop a NEW recording signal with added colorations/noise/distortions levels that we don’t have. We have a different recording signalwhere we all try to preserve its integrity and at the same time looking for its best quality level reproduction.

 

Something wrong with what you do? NO because it’s what you like:longer signal path to your NEW signal according YOUR TASTE that is unique like the " taste " of any other gentlemans but obviously different.. GOOD, no problem.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS.

rauliruegas
13,384 posts
 

Dear @toddalin  :I missed those Sprague. Btw, the main power supply elctrolitic caps in my Levinson monoblocks were Sprague that Vishay bought company and now my amps comes with the Vishay and are great as everything Vishay manufactures.

 

R

rauliruegas
13,384 posts
 

Carlos, I forgot that you changed caps your items have for PIO ones that is a " technology " used in the home radio in the Second World War. Yes, that's you that have degrees in Physics and over 40 years in audio. Go figure.

 

Audiogon Discussion Forum

carlos269's avatar
carlos269 OP
483 posts
 

Modern paper-in-oil (PIO) capacitors are available from various manufacturers, offering a modern take on vintage-style components with updated materials and construction for improved reliability and performance. Some companies produce new-old-stock (NOS) military-grade PIO capacitors, while others create new versions with specific sound qualities like warm and dynamic sound. 

From the internet:

Modern reproductions and new designs

  • Luxe Capacitors (Mojotone): These are designed to replicate the sound and look of vintage Sprague caps using a similar vintage winding machine.
  • V-Cap OIMP series: A premium option featuring a metalized polypropylene film with a custom oil impregnation process in a hermetically sealed brass canister for high performance and durability.
  • Jupiter Condenser: Offers "new old stock" (NOS) and modern paper-in-oil capacitors, such as the aluminum foil and mineral oil versions, hermetically sealed for reliable performance.
  • AmpOhm: Known for modern, current-production oil capacitors with excellent sound quality at a reasonable price.
  • Rike Audio Q-Cap: This is a modern copper-foil paper-in-oil capacitor that uses a polypropylene dielectric for a different sonic characteristic than traditional paper dielectrics. 
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