Time to upgrade the pre-amp.


I am currently running and ARC SP-16l into an Art Audio PX-25 power amp which feeds a pair of Blumenhofer Genuin FS2s (94db). I listen to mostly vinyl atm, and I have an external phono stage (Icon PS1 mkii). I think at this point, the pre-amp is the weak link.

Although I am not wedded to buying another ARC preamp, I am leaning in that direction due to company reputation, longevity, accessibility of local dealers (Northern NJ) and resale value, though I am definitely looking for that full mid-range and "musicality" typically associated with all tube architectures.

I have an opportunity to buy an SP-11 for $4,000, and from what I am seeing, if I wait, I may be able to get an SP-10 in that same range. However, for ~$2,000 more, I could likely get a Ref 5SE, which would be the top of the budget, but has in addition to any sonic advantages, a remote and tube hour tracker.

My questions are: (1) is it worth holding out for the newer Ref series (~10 yrs old at this point) vs the SP10/11 which are 40 years old at this point; and (2) if it comes between the SP10 and SP11, What I have read here is that the SP10 is all tube, but while that unit’s phono stage is particularly strong, the rest of the line inputs are not up to the SP-11. If it turns out that they are close, I would likely choose the SP10 between those two.

Very interested in how folks think about this.

saulh

I've been very interested in the AR preamps as well.

 

I'm curious, what parts in the older reference models are of concern as far as potentially not  being available?

 

 

OP,

generally, what volume level is your ARC preamp set at for normal listening?

What about the amp's GAIN? OP's Speakers sensitivity are 94 db/w/m

found this pecking about:

https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=176890.0


"It might be useful in the specifications section to inform the buyer of what the overall gain of the amplifier is since you are stating that it has too much gain for your 108dB horn system.

The specs state a power output of 6 watts. I am going to assume that this is RMS and also that it is at an impedance of 8 ohms. The specs also state a 400mV input sensitivity. I am going to assume that this input sensitivity is what is needed to pump out 6 watts RMS (clipping).

So let's do the math.

Using P=V (squared)/R; where P is wattage and R is impedance. V then works out to 6.93 Vrms.

If the maximum output power is 6.93 Vrms and to reach that maximum power you need to input 400mV rms (or 0.4V rms), then gain is calculated by:

gain = 20 *dB log (X) where log X is equal to log (6.92/0.4) or 1.24.

gain = 20*1.24 = 24 to 25 dB.

So gain works out to be 25 dB, which indeed might be too much for a 108dB horn system (power being a separate issue of course). I would aim for 12 to 16dB of overall gain in a system that is that sensitive.  This is of course relative to what your source (dac, vinyl, others) is producing and if you have a preamp in the system as well. It requires a careful balance.

Pretty amps though! GLWS!

Best,
Anand."

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I've visited OP's home, heard his wonderful system.

One of the issues with the ARC SP16L Preamp is each 'step' in the volume is too much of a jump, not smooth like normal remote volumes. We thought it was inherent to that model, a motivation to change. Are the steps 'heightened' by the amp's gain? Avoid any 'stepped' volume control in an alternate unit?

 

I am of the mind that if a system is passive friendly, and I think that the OPs, like mine is, then a very good passive linestage is hard to beat. I have plenty of gain from both digital and analog sources. I understand that an analog front end can be challenging, but with my SS Carmen II (2.2 mV) into an SPL Phonos using the 50db of MM gain, I have plenty of volume.

I know some think only active preamps can give the body and slam to the music they prefer. But I contend that in the right system, this is not so. I suggest anyone interested in a good passive give Hattor Audio a look.

 

http://www.hattor.com/dualmono_preamp_the_big.html

I’ve had an ARC SP6B since 1981, and most of the repairs needed on it were for cold or cracked solder joints. Nothing serious. I imagine the same would be true for an SP10 or 11. But my preamp has needed repairs once every 5 years or so since 2000.