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Interesting experience with two very different speaker designs

I wanted to relay my experience with two different sets of speakers in hopes that it might prove interesting and/or help some folks.

My current speakers are Tekton Electron SE with a Pass XA30.5 and a MicroZOTL2 Preamp.  I was absolutely loving the sound but I started getting into the DIY open baffle thing.  I started with a very simple JE labs design with a single driver and after a few prototypes, I ended up with a 2-way using an Emminence Alpha 15 and a Tang Band W8 2145.

After breaking the DIY speakers in a bit, I was really blown away.  The soundstage was huge and very 3D.  The bass was big and warm but still pretty fast and articulate.  Also, the speed of the speakers was very apparent.  I loved them especially on big orchestral works where the soundstage really comes to life.

I lived with them for about 4 months and then I put the Electrons back.  Very interesting.  Timbrally, the Electrons were just better.  The OBs upper midrange sounded kind of flat and beamy in comparison.  The bass on the Electrons, though not as extended, was better controlled.  In some ways I found the OBs to be more transparent in that they really pointed out the flaws in some recordings.  Well recorded stuff sounded amazing but they gave no love to mediocre recordings.  The Electrons just make everything sound good. Much more forgiving.  

Going from the OBs to the Electrons, I lost some of that soundstage magic.  The Electrons, though they have some depth, lack that completely open 3D thing that the OBs were giving me.  However, from top to bottom, they just sound right.  Instruments sound like how they are supposed to sound.  That all-important midrange really shines.

Though I like both these speakers, I'm going to stick with the Tektons.  However, if what you value is speed, transparency and soundstage over timbre, I think open baffle is a good way to go.  I'll say this with the caveat that I'm not a speaker designer and there may be OB speakers out there that really get the timbre thing right too.  I'd love to hear some!
adam8179
sandthemall
543 posts
 
Having the same experience with my new Tannoy Turnberry GRs. I sold my old Salk Songtowers to get them. The Songtowers were pretty amazing top to bottom. Everything sounded wonderful. Great bass... outstanding soundstage.

The Tannoys are pretty amazing at timbre and detail. I'm hearing things that are spooky good...things that were simply not there before...maybe because of the increased efficiency. But man, some stuff is down right rough to listen to. I have only 25 hours on them so from most forums I've read, there are more hours to get them settled in.

I do like the bigger sonic picture but completely frustrating and fascinating at the same time.
pfiche
8 posts
 
I have been playing with an O.B. design with The Alpha 15 and TB W-8 for awhile. I agree it is fast, quick impact, great drums, acoustic guitar and warm vocals. Fun to listen to, with good recordings sounding great and so-so and some old recordings, are not enjoyable.

Yes, can be dry and lack that twinkle and sheen. Tried to stay full range without x-over but that was not going to work even with EQ. I tried severaldifferent tweeters in multiple positions and various x-over points but nothing was working. I finally worked in a B.G. Neo 3 open baffle  planer tweeter and it worked pretty dang good. Fast, more open on top end but lost a little warmth.  All in all blended quiet well and quiet livable.

Still in search for that little extra, I worked in the Dayton Audio ES104AMT  tweeter and it added some magic on the top end, happy for now, most enjoyable. More open, larger stage and great image. These will last for a little while.

Notes:
O.B design does not waste rear energy, it helps cancel at 90 degrees to reduce sidewall  reflections that can smear the signal reducing  image. Wasted energy is inside closed box speakers, companies spend a lot of money to nullify that energy, and some can still leak back out through the cone material.

18' x 13'  room, varied height ceiling, speakers set at 29% off front wall and 29% off L&R wall, ear height, tilted in aimed at L&R shoulders. Seating centered and about 7' from speakers.
Use high quality x-over components, and dampening material on larger inside surfaces.
Finished  off 4 dual V.C. 10" isobaric subs, 2 in front and 2 in back of room out of phase for very bottom end.
adam8179 OP
66 posts
 
@pfiche

Yes, that was my general assessment of the W8 Eminence 15 combo!  Great for drums guitar and vocals.  Bass energy could get a bit boomy even after I put them on spikes.  I agree about the dryness.  Its not the meatiest of midranges though it is incredibly fast and detailed.  Piano and saxophones are not as rich sounding as they are on my Tektons 

I was toying with the idea or adding a super tweeter aimed up at the ceiling.  Maybe I'll try that down the road.  These DIY speakers are keepers even if they might live most of their lives in the shed!

One of the reasons I was interested in OB designs is exactly what you pointed out pfiche.  The cancelation of the frequencies at 90 degrees lessens room interaction.  That being said, I have diffusors on the back wall and bass traps in the corners to deal with that energy.  I think the dipole design adds to that sense of a wide open and 3D soundstage in a room


blkwrxwgn
240 posts
 
millercarbon11,408 posts10-18-2021 2:54pmOpen baffle puts a lot of energy out the back side of the speaker. This contributes to that spacious 3D sound. Eric just added a new Signature Series model with two drivers on the back for just this reason.

I don’t know how you had your Electrons set up, but if you want 3D imaging with a nice deep stage they should be aimed almost directly at your ears and absolutely perfectly equidistant and symmetrical, with the exact same toe in L and R. Use a tape measure, point the L at your L shoulder, R at R and you will hear some pretty darn good imaging. Then if you put them on Townshend Podiums I think you will forget all about open baffle for once and all.
Sorry, great info that applies to your system or setup but I don’t agree with this at all. My DI’s like to have almost no toe in at all and the Electrons are more in line with the DI’s in design. I tried setting mine up like you are saying and I had a very narrow soundstage, all sound was coming straight from the speakers and sounded horrible.

Also, I had the Spatial Audio M3 Triode Masters before the Tektons and I did not like the sound at all.  They ended A LOT of space behind them, like at least 3' but more in the 4'+ range to sound good.  There was almost no midrange in mine either, wasn't a fan at all.

danager's avatar
danager
871 posts
 
I had the same experience with ADS L12390ii and Dahlquist DQ12s.  The Dahquist are hybrids with a open top and a sealed woofer creating a tighter bass.  The NOLA speaker still use this configuration.  Teckton does make an open baffle also using a ported bass box.
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