Astro58go-- What affects deep cleaning more? this is a very interesting and tough question to answer. As with most complicated questions, it depends. I don't mean to be feaseasus, but it depends on the nature of the issue you are deep cleaning for. If it is an issue with just finger prints(ie oil from a person), which are typically tough to remove, i find that the detergent/surfactant added with a little heat is the key. if it is a dirt or grit deep in the groove, the concentrated bubble just excels in rooting this out. I have used so many versions from the original discwasher system (my first record purchase, i also brought a discwasher back in early 70's) to the Ultrasonic process followed by the rinse/vacuum. Each approach whether using a brush with vigorous scrubbing or implementing a steaming regiment as part of the scrubbing was based on trying to solve a particular problem. I remember two old records from my fathers collection. the first was an old Chet Atkins record and the second was a Bobby Darin album. The Chet Atkins was one of my fathers favorite and he played it so many times. Long story short, both records did not have a sleeve and due to many years of bad habits led to these being pretty hard to listen two. As i would learn or try a new way of doing something, i would try to clean both of these to see if the sound improved. I could look under a scope and tell there was crap in the grooves, but i couldnt get it all out. As i did the steaming and scrubbing, the record got much clearer sound. That is when i really understood the importance of a little heat. However the ultrasonic cleaner with a little heat actually made the Bobby Darin album a lot better. Both still had a lot of surface noise but they were now listenable. Sorry for such a long answer to one of your questions.
Rushton's DIY approach to ultrasonic record cleaning published by Positive Feedback
Over the past several months I’ve invested a fair amount of time exploring ultrasonic cleaning because I’ve fallen way too far behind in my record cleaning. With over 6000 LPs, I needed a faster way to clean than my trusted multi-step manual wet/vac cleaning process. That manual process got the best results I’ve ever found, but I was not keeping up with my collection and it is just painful to me to play a record that I’ve not cleaned.
In exploring ultrasonic cleaning, my hope was to find that I could complete multiple LPs in a single US cleaning cycle and greatly speed up my rate of cleaning records. My goals were to FIRST do no harm and then SECOND see how close I could get to the results of my manual cleaning regimen.
My past experiences with ultrasonic cleaning demonstrations were completely underwhelming. What I heard did not approach the excellence I was achieving with my multi-step wet/vac cleaning regimen.
What I’ve learned, and now apply in my new ultrasonic cleaning regimen, are multiple elements to the cleaning process that must be used in combination to achieve the best possible results. And these results have far exceeded my expectations.
I’d thought of posting here on Audiogon the summary of what I’ve learned and am now applying as my new record cleaning regimen, but the inability to post images and to apply formatting here caused me to send my summary to David Robinson at Positive Feedback who has graciously published my comments as a guest essay. Please read that essay, and then come back here to Audiogon with comments and to share your experiences:
http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/rushton-paul-diy-approach-ultrasonic-cleaning-lps/
I look forward to some further discussion and sharing of experiences.
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Nice story about the records from your father's collection, oilmanjojo. I enjoyed reading it. For another point of interest, today I have 4 audio friends over to listen to music. One wanted a demonstration of the ultrasonic cleaning regimen. Two others both had ultrasonic cleaning systems and said they had no interest in a demo, but were polite enough to sit through it for the one. The one coming for a demonstration brought vinyl already well cleaned to his satisfaction using his multi-step enzyme cleaning process (similar to the one I've used for years before changing to my current regiment). After listening selections from to his already cleaned LPs, I put them through my US regimen. Then we re-listened. And everyone agreed that all four records sounded better in very noticeable ways after the US cleaning: greater openness of the soundstage, more extended highs and harmonic overtones, deeper tighter bass. We also listened to some records not previously cleaned to see if we heard the same sonic results. The one who wanted the demonstration is now convinced he needs to shift his cleaning process to ultrasonic plus the cleaning solution in the tank, plus rinse. More interesting, the two who already used ultrasonic and didn't need a demo heard significant improvements they were not hearing from their own US processes and are now planning to make some changes based on what they heard here. I share this story because there are many people using some variation on ultrasonic cleaning. For me, this was some validation that there is more to getting great results from US cleaning than just getting a US tank. As I learned in my own experiments, and as these existing US cleaner users heard for themselves, it is the combination of factors: the right cleaning solution in the tank, keeping the solution in the tank very clean by filtering between batches of records, heat in both the tank and the rinse, rinsing, and ultrapure water second rinse. It all adds up to improved results. Cheers! |
rushton, Your last post was very informative, yet, on par with the current climate. I, like you, can appreciate the process... I, like you, can appreciate the results. ...and so on. While I feel that you have obtained, maybe, THE best solution, I too have a great solution. (This is not to say which one is right) Read on... I think my point is, while you have considerable time and expense in your posting, and while others can easily hear the result, in the end, (just like many of my posts and thoughts here), people will read these posts and maybe respond (once) or even better, add a post or two, but in the end, (they) all revert back into their own universe. I'm sad to say this, but it's true. What I have found that kind of keeps me going... even when I think I have had something... some little piece of useful info to share...then, only to have one or even no response, can be deflating. I, like you, (I think) wish more people that find one's research useful, would just post their findings! Is this too much to ask! Happy Listening! ..on a lighter note... oilmanmojo, your using the word (feaseasus), WOW!, reminded me of the Andy Griffith show. Barney, well I hope you get it?! Cheers! |
astrog58go: What I have found that kind of keeps me going... even when I think I have had something... some little piece of useful info to share...then, only to have one or even no response, can be deflating.astrog58go and slaw, it is kind of you both to comment. All any of us can do is offer the information, whether on this current topic, our experiences with different turntables, our experiences with different configurations of gear, of tweaks, of room treatment, of household wiring, etc. etc. As you say, it is nice when others add to the discussion or at least acknowledge. But, when I look at the number of views a given post has obtained, that often will be very gratifying. For example, a review I posted 12 years ago on the Walker Audio Proscenium turntable has received over 250,000 views but only 40 comments. Was this contribution useful or interesting to the community? My guess is "Yes", and so I will keep contributing where I have an interest in something. Hopefully the information on diy solutions for ultrasonic cleaning will find some resonance among members of the community even though the discussion here is somewhat limited. |
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