What's up with lousy bass on classic rock recordings?


Few examples: ACDC Back In Black, Van Halen 1, Boston (1), WHO's Next, Def Leopard Pyromania. 

The low end is almost non-existent. Digital and vinyl. 

It's not my system, I listen to a lot of jazz, other classics like Janis Ian Breaking Silence - bass is rich, full, has slam when appropriate.

Compression? Or were the low frequencies never there? Pretty disappointing. 

macg19

Showing 14 responses by macg19

@erik_squires good point, never had a boom box, but I did have JBL 6x9's with an Alpine head and amp in the trunk - that was fun

Responding to the comments so far...

I've listened to most of my rock examples on vinyl and digital. VH 1 was a digital remaster (Qobuz).

The vinyl examples are not remasters, but also not original pressings. Another example is a MOFI Master of the Cars (debut album) - sounds really nice but bass is just OK - tight and detailed but not room-filling if that makes sense.

Breaking Silence (I have a relatively new pressing of the 2012 re-issue but it was originally recorded in 1992) - was a very well recorded session and the lower end sounds full, rich and detailed.

Many old Jazz recordings, the double bass often sounds rich and full.

To clarify, I'm not saying there is no bass, I guess they are just not leveraging my subs as much. 

The system is dialed in, or I wouldn't be getting such a full range response with other recordings, and the bass is not bloated or boomy - I hate that.

I will try turning up the crossover a couple of clicks and having another listen though.

The Who “Live at Leeds” is a terrific recording (same for Live at Hull and Isle of Wight).

VH III has fine sonics.

I'll give these a try, thanks for the suggestions.

Thanks jayfant but it’s not my system. As I mentioned several of the examples are vinyl. 

Here is another example: I’ve got a lot of Tom Petty on vinyl but often stream for convenience and the bass is great on either medium.

I do not have a CD/Sacd player.

I plan on testing the suggested tracks and playing with the sub crossover levels though - could need a slightly higher setting for tracks with more prominent mid-bass 

Did some quick testing using Running with the Devil:

  • Qobuz only (dont have vinyl)
  • Remastered HR version and "Digital 45" CD

D45 was a bit better, both with and without 80Hz sub-pass on, adding gain and volume to subs (separately). Still just OK

and Baba O’Reilly.

  • Qobuz HR and vinyl (2015 reissue)

Vinyl was a bit better bass-wise, filter/gain adjustments as above, still just OK.

Live at Leads (Qobuz) - similar.

My conclusions...

  • maybe the lower sub-bass frequencies that really fill/pressurize the room simply are not there
  • could be the vinyl (I may try and find a couple of original pressings)
  • could be the streaming files (not much I can do about that - other than get a better streamer which is on the roadmap)
  • could be the speaker/sub combo - I’ve often toyed with the idea of getting a second set of full-range "rock" speakers - for example I’ve heard some vintage Tannoy’s with the 12" dual-concentric that sounded pretty amazing - or maybe some JBLs.

EDIT: other examples why I don't think it's my system - MOFI recordings of Truth, Dire Straits (debut) and DSOTM - all awesome.

@lowrider57 Looks like you have a nice system - I don't disagree with you - in hind-sight "lousy" bass was a poor choice of words. 

What's missing is deep, lush bass that I've come to really enjoy that is present in many other rock recordings (and other genres of course).

@baylinor @itsjustme @relayer101 @overthemoon @gosta 

Thanks. All interesting and meaningful comments.

Quick comment, I have LA Woman on vinyl, I was really surprised how good the SQ is too - bass is great - it's a lot of fun listening to that one cranked.

@mapman I use an SPL app on my iPhone routinely to protect my hearing and yes the low end down to 31Hz is prominent.

Did you look at my system?

@mapman I don’t have a white noise generator and the SPL app only measures down to 31Hz, so thanks for the offer!

Baba O’Reilly (I’ve tried HR Quobuz and I have it on vinyl) and VH 1 Running with the Devil and Eruption (Quobuz - no vinyl)

But I really do think it’s the recordings AND the SQ/dynamics that I now prefer.

EDIT: and as someone pointed out some of this is meant to be played really loud, and I try to keep peaks below 90dB

Back in the day my car had a better stereo than my home (JBL 6x9s - no one had subs back then with an Alpine head and amp in the trunk) and what I have today far surpasses anything prior - and it’s all relatively new gear.

@mapman Thanks this is really interesting.

You're tagging someone else though I'm macg19 and your tagging dmac67 

@gosta 

I find the Diamond Stars Halo very well recorded with all the bass you can wish for.

Just listened to this all the way through - great album and yes plenty of bass - thanks for the suggestion.