vr4 Jr vs. B&W Signature 805

Let me explain my comments about the finish on the B&W's. Being a woodworker, I have an appreciation for the natural beauty of wood. I think that the natural grain and color of the wood be allowed to speak for itself. I guess you can tell that I don't use stains on my projects. If I want something to be red, then I use a natural red wood like bloodwood or paduak. If I want black, then I use wenge or ebony. I don't like to use finishes that cover up the grain of the wood such a poly or many coats of lacquer. The only time I use poly is on table tops; two light coats with sanding between applications.

In my opinion, when you use many coats of finish to make the wood look like "plastic wood" then you might as well use plastic wood and save some time and money. I guess you can tell that I'm not a big fan of "piano" finish. However, there are places were they look very classy, such as on pianos.

This is just my opinion. If you like "piano" finishes or "lacquered" finishes, that's fine with me.

James, the main differences between the two are, the new N805S has a different (improved) crossover design and the beautiful Signature finishes are not available, obviously; so yes, they are quite close to one another in that they incorporated the Sig technology into them.

I have the Red Bird's Eye, one of the best looking finishes ever put on a speaker. Resembles some of the limited Steinway finishes. Is the new 805s the same speaker as the signature except for cabinet?

Prpixel, $2500.

I'd also like to add, for the readers, another opinion of the Signatures finish. I own the same finish as Prpixel had above, grey Tigers Eye, but my reaction is just the opposite; "regular" nautilus speakers, while very nice, pale IMO after owning the Sigs; I cannot express enough how much I like the finish on the Signatures. To each our own.

Blueball,

Pricing on the new 805S?

Thanks,

805 Signatures now available as the new 805s,launched this month,they are basically the Signatures without the fancy finish,a lot cheaper in price also.

I had a chance to audition the jr's against the 805sigs in my dedicated listening room, which has been tuned. Equipment included Anthem AVM20, Aragon palladium monos, xindak sacd2 and cardas golden cross cables.

Now, you have to keep in mind that there are 5 drivers in the jr's verses 2 in the 805sigs. Price is comparable when you add the B&W stands. A lot of money goes into the 805's cabinet. VS manufacturers their cabinets in China to save cost. I have had many conversations with Kevin at VS about this, so please don't email me.

Both speakers were broken in for at least 500 hours before audition with cable radio played 24/7. The 805's were on custom made mass loaded stands which were spiked to the carpet. The jr's were filled with lead shot and spiked also. Positioning was dialed in over a few days. Each speaker was bi-wired and the tails on the speaker cables were long enough to allow removal of the abilicus on the jr's.

The jr's had the better bottom end. Of course, were comparing two 7" woofers and a mid to one 6.5" woofer/mid. As far as the mids go, it was pretty close. Now, before I talk about the highs, let me say the following. A lot of people think that B&W's are bright. Having owned 5 pairs in the last 5 years (N802's, N805's, N805sigs, LM1's and DM303's) I find that this is not the case. I do find them very revealing. So, if your equipment or recording has any shortcomings, then the B&W's are going to reveal them in all their glory. I found the highs on the jr's to be very detailed, but with a slight tendency toward being etched. I played around with the ambiance tweeter, but was unable to alleviate this. The highs on the 805sigs were detailed and extended. So, the nod goes to the 805's sigs on the highs. The jr's threw a good soundstage, but the 805sigs were holographic and 3 dimensional. I had people thinking that they were listening to surround sound; the sound stage was that big and deep. You could actually hear things coming from behind you on some recordings.

Now, you must keep in mind that me listening room has been professionally tuned and there are actually 48 acoustic panels on the walls of different values.

So, which one would I choose? I think that the VR4jr's are a lot of bang for the buck. And, they make a good all around speaker for someone that enjoys music and home theater. About the only thing I could fault them sonically was the slight etching in the highs. However, the biggest disappointment was the cabinets. The finish on them looked like something you would see in K-mart. The stained birch veneer looked fake, and there was only a very thin coat of clear lacquer. Now, if your just into music, go with the 805sigs. Their soundstage is magic. However, once again I was disappointed with the cabinets. I had the black tiger maple finish and there was so many coats of lacquer on them that they looked like plastic. Why didn't they just leave the curly maple natural? The red stained birdseye, which is a faux finish, was just as bad.

The VR4jr's belonged to a friend who was kind enough to let me break them in for a few months. I purchased the 805sigs for myself. After about 6-8 months I sold them because I hated the finish. While I loved the sound of them, I just couldn't look at them everyday. I even went as far as to call B&W to ask them if thay could make me a pair in natural cherry. Their reply was that the finish differentiates them from the regular 805's and they refused.

I am repeating myself here, but:

A custom system designer friend of mine had the following setup:
B&W800N signatures with a Rel subwoofer driven by two Krell FPB700's. He was not happy.
He swapped to the 805N signatures driven by only one FPB700.
He is now happy with the sound.

The 805N signature is a very different speaker than the 805.
The 800N signature is functionally the same as the 800N.

The 805N signature may be the biggest bargain on the market!

Richard

I did an A/B comparison with the N805 and the VR2 and to my ears the VR2 was cleary the better speaker. I have also extensively listened to the VR4jr, which I feel are better than the VR2s. Only missing piece of the puzzle is that I have never heard the Signature 805.

This question can also be room dependant, in a smaller room the Signatures may be easier to integrate and could reinforce the low end nicely. Both the VR speakers have deep bass, and ambience drivers. What this means is that the VR speakers should be pulled out from the front wall for ideal placement which cleans up the low bass and allows the ambience driver to shine.

Hope this helps.