The "Snake Oil" Trope


Yeah I know, a controversial topic, but after 30+ years of hearing both sides and seeing how the argument has evolved over the years, I want to say my piece.

First, I want to debunk the idea of ever using the term, "Snake Oil" because it has been incorrectly appropriated and is not being applied genuinely. For a product to be "Snake Oil" it isn't a simple matter of, "it doesn't do what it claims to do." It has to contain a few more qualities. Chief among them, the materials or ingredients have to be fake, falsified, or non-existent. I have yet to encounter a single premium cable manufacturer who has claimed to use copper or silver and it was fake.

This would be an example of cable "Snake Oil" if it existed:

Company claim: "A 10 gauge speaker wire made of ten 9's pure silver, extracted from conflict-free mines, using NASA quality FEP dielectrics, braided in 24 strands of 17 gauge wire, all concealed in the newly developed element, Star-Spangled-Bannerite, that enhances and boosts all frequencies, repairing broken audio as it travels down the conductor."

Reality: Cutting open the wire you find 3 strands of 14 gauge aluminum wire, wrapped in Glad's saran-wrap, threaded through a 10 gauge rubber garden hose, covered in a fancy colored net.

My biggest problem with the nay-sayer community is the hypocrisy of their accusation that premium quality cables are "Snake Oil" when their charts, measurements and tests have the same level of skepticism they purport to debunk. Using "Snake Oil" to prove "Snake Oil?" Ask yourself the following questions when you next see some online or vlog rant about how cables don't make a difference and they have the measurements to prove it:

1) Did they actually connect the cables to speakers and listen?
2) If they made measurements, did they show you how those cables were connected when they conducted the tests?
3) If it is a vlog, did they show in the video live footage of them conducting the test or is everything after-the-fact?
4) How does the test prove quality and how does the author quantify "quality?"

99% of the time the answer is "no." You just see people posting pictures of charts that could have been made using any form of software.  Heck, I could make one in Photoshop that dictates any conclusion I want. The truth is, there isn't a single form of equipment or measurement software that tests the actual perceived quality or clarity of a signal.

For example, "that guy" from Audioholics posted a video bashing a $4000 Audioquest speaker cable.  He claims to have run it through tests and he posted pictures of graphs that he gave conclusions for.  Not once did he show how it was connected to the machines or equipment. More over, he claimed to have broken the cable, by easily snapping off the banana plug (made of pure copper coated in silver). Well, if that were true, then how could he have possibly connected the cable correctly to test it?  He also claimed the cable was on loan from Audioquest.  Red flag. Audioquest does not send out one speaker cable to test; they'd have sent out a pair.  He also wasn't at all concerned that he had broken a $4000 loaner cable.  Therefore, I suspect someone else broke their own cable and let "this guy" borrow it for a video. Lastly, he claims to test the effectiveness of the "DBS" system by showing you a digital read out on some other machine.  He claims to unplug the DBS system live...but...off screen, and the digital read out changes. That makes absolutely no sense, since the DBS system isn't tied to the actual conductors or connectors. It's a charged loop from end to end and only keeps the insulation's dielectric field charged. So unplugging it while a signal is being passed through the cable wouldn't change anything. Therefore,  the nay-sayer argument, in this instance, was nothing more than "Snake Oil" trying to prove "Snake Oil."

Another time, someone was given a premium XLR cable, but had no idea what an XLR cable was.  They didn't recognize the connector format; a red flag straight away!  Then goes on to claim all the different measurements they took from it and how it was no better than the free cables you get from manufacturers.  Well, if that is true, how was this cable connected to the equipment? If he didn't know what the XLR format was, then it stands to reason they didn't have an XLR input on the equipment they used to test. Therefore, how in the world was this an equitable or viable test of the quality if the cable's conductors weren't all being used correctly during the test? Not once did this person connect it to an audio system to say how it sounded. How do electrical measurements translate into sound quality if one refuses to listen to it?

My final argument against the nay-sayers is one they all have the most trouble with. They don't use the Scientific Method.  For example, where's the control in these tests? What system or cable do they universally *ALL* agree is perfect and that they test against? The systems and cables always change and are never consistent. Why is it that they argue for an A / B test, but aren't willing to set one up for themselves? As if it's someone else's responsibility because they refuse to be responsible for their conclusions. Why is it that they only test low end or middle grade cables, but never seem to run these tests on the highest levels? Why is it that the majority of nay-sayers never purchase any of this equipment to find out for themselves?

What I have discovered after 30+ years of arguing this topic, is that the nay-sayers just don't want to have to buy expensive cables.  Instead they seek out any form of cognitive bias they can find to use as justification to not buy it.  Then suddenly concern themselves with other people's purchase power and tell them not to purchase such cables, as if these people are spending their money. Or they claim that they should have spent all that money on better equipment. Touche', but if they bought better equipment, they'd still buy premium cables to push that better equipment. That's like saving your money to buy a Lamborghini, then deciding on buying 15 inch steel rims with narrow tires for it because wheels are wheels...they bought a better vehicle, so won't need premium tires...or premium gas because the engine is superior. *eye roll.* What it seems to boil down to is that they don't like the idea that just buying premium cables alone can surpass a high grade, well-engineered system. To borrow from my car analogy, buying premium tires for a 4-cylynder hatch back won't make it go any faster, but it will effect some performance, likely gas mileage and road grip. Using the same analogy, buying better cables is akin to buying a turbo kit, back-exhaust system, better suspension, better intake valves, better cold air filters, etc to make that 4-cylinder hatch back perform nearly as well as a stock   Lamborghini.

Final thoughts, "Snake Oil" salesmen back in the day weren't just interested in defrauding their customers, they wanted to do it with the least amount of effort. They didn't try to get authentic, high quality ingredients to make the oil look or taste better.  They used whatever was on-hand and as free as possible. Cable companies sure seem to go out of their way to acquire the best possible conductors and materials, and have R&D teams engineer complicated wire geometries and spend years finding ways to treat the cables, or develop active tech to impact the signal, just so they can make a few bucks. If the product had absolutely no impact on sound quality, at all,  it wouldn't take long for well-engineered systems to reveal their faults and the industry would tank, almost over night. Clearly, they haven't and it's because it isn't "Snake Oil" no matter how many times that old trope is trotted out.

One of the serious problems in this entire discussion is that the perception of "quality" is 100% subjective to the listener, the state of the equipment, the room it is being conducted in, and health of the listener. After years of auditioning my system to people, I realized it isn't a simple matter of asking, "How did that sound to you." You have to be very specific.  Ask, "Did you hear that specific sound?"  9 times out of 10, they'll say they didn't hear it.  So you play it again and point it out.  Then they light up and realize that no matter how many times they heard that song, they had never heard that particular sound.  Then they go and compare it to the car radio or through their device's ear buds and realize they cannot hear it or couldn't hear it as clear.  Then they come to respect what you're trying to achieve.




128x128guakus
@millercarbon...” Where I have to say "not fine" though is when you pull your hypocritical "attitude" attack! “

Oh The Irony...
Ideas and opinions are increasingly obsolete as humankind evolves/devolves. Innovations in human communication means we all have more than enough information to become expert in whatever endeavor/debate we choose. Experts tend to become enamored with their opinions/ideas, segue into beliefs.

Recently, it came to my attention that robots/machines cannot hear, and humans cannot be objective. Therefore, I will carry on as before and listen and build my system for my own pleasure. I heard cables with different sound signatures, therefore, cable choices for me may be in flux from time to time.
I have no problem with naysayers claims that cables make no difference to them, this is a subjective viewpoint. But for them to claim cables can make no difference to anyone goes into the belief realm. Also, hypocritical in when backing this claim with scientific rigor in the form of double blind tests which they in fact didn't use when deciding on their own cable purchase.
I do see this one difference between the two packs of believers. While cable believers will argue amongst themselves as to qualitative judgments of cables, naysayers have no such issue. Many shades of grey for most cable believers, its all black and white for the objectivists. So my question is: Can a belief system even exist when so many shades of grey exist? Seems like pretty shaky religion to me. So, are we in fact, not really believers, merely holders of opinions? Belief thrives in black and white estimations of truth.

Further, this belief is built on the idea of scientific rigor and double blind tests. Has a single naysayer ever heard every single cable in double blind test?  Assuming not, an absolutist belief system built on speculation, that kind of belief system shouldn't last a day.

This is the last subjectivist vs objectivist cable thread I'll participate in. There is no argument really, we're all subjectivists and to say otherwise is a falsehood. No machine or robots can stand in for us and present us with some objective set of data to negate human subjectivity, and no religion or belief system can dictate what is objective truth. I leave it to those defending beliefs and religions to fight it out.
sns - "There is no argument really, we're all subjectivists and to say otherwise is a falsehood. No machine or robots can stand in for us and present us with some objective set of data to negate human subjectivity..." Yep, thats the bottom-line. I've been saying that for years. 
We're touching onto a human phenomenon that has always been the downfall of human civilization.  The "Us vs Them" dilemma. One side gets an idea that the other side cannot tolerate. It builds and tension grows until it boils over. No side ever comes out on top. Generally, there is a great collapse and then a slow rebuild, until the cycle starts again.

The thing that separates "Cable Theory" from causing the downfall of audio and being an audiophile, is money. As has been stated in this thread, people are spending their money on expensive cables regardless of nay-sayer opinion.  Therefore, their opinion has little weight or affect on the industry. It begs the question of, "why bother making the argument to begin with?"  As has also been said in this thread, whose business is it to command people, through besmirching, on what folks should or shouldn't buy?

I know I will continue to receive condemnation for my opinion and statements, but I am going to sink it further by stating what *MY* observation over the decades has been. Some might identify with it and others won't.  Every instance I have come across on the "snake oil" trope begins the same way:

Person One: "I got this cool cable and it made this awesome impact on my sound."

Person Two: "You're <insert demeaning insult here> for spending all that money.  It's 'snake oil.'"

Then the argument begins. Not to paint with so big a brush, but it fits the definition of bigotry.

"obstinate or unreasonable attachment to a belief, opinion, or faction, in particular prejudice against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group. "

Sorry to say, but we have seen this very behavior on this thread.

Yeah, I am aware, the incorrect and all too common counter to this is, "But you're not being tolerant of our intolerance against your belief!!  That means you're a bigot too!!!" This misconception is because no one wants to feel bad about being wrong. However, being intolerant of someone's intolerance, isn't bigotry. Sorry, it isn't, no matter how convenient it is to think so.

So, by all means, bring on the hate. It won't change anything. My system will still sound good to me as will my belief that the cables I purchased are easily 50% of the reason it sounds good. The only person who has to enjoy my system is me.
We're touching onto a human phenomenon that has always been the downfall of human civilization.

So, by all means, bring on the hate. It won't change anything.

What a lovely thread.