scientific double blinded cable test

shadorne"Obviously if a manufacturer could prove their high end cable to be audibly superior to others then you can bet one or more of the hundreds of manufacturers would be offering demonstrations"

Actually the simple and easily shown proof of this matter is that both manufacturers and audio dealers perform these kinds of demonstrations all of the time so what you might consider is actually attending one of these demonstrations using an actual Music Reproduction System and see and hear for yourself that you're information here is profoundly misinformed but of course it is easier to simply proselytize from the comfort of your easy chair than actually undertake any listening tests.

gdhal"obviously if a forum member could demonstrate they could hear a difference with said cable oriented one way or the other, they would have taken me up on the offer I made herein this thread on 03-10-2018 6:55pm"
I am sorry I don't see that offer in my feed here could you please repeat it for the beenfit of the rest of us? If you are offering actual financial renumeration I would like to participate NOT because I need the money but to simply put this matter to rest for once and for all. I can assure you confidentally well in advance of any such test that you must be prepared to part with your money because I have already past these double blinded tests on multilpe occassions as has been documented elsewhere.

gdhal this discussion regarding your $25,000 offer is to be conducted here under the protective umbrella of the forums participants and moderators when we progress to a set of  mutually agreed upon terms actual specific naturally private details will be exchanged privately but within the Audiogon private message system for everyone's protection. We can settle these absurd snakeoil everything sounds the same claims for once and for all but this will be a public process including the actual test itself for the benefit of the audiophile community.

gdhal"I thought we already discussed the matter and were to proceed to the next step. My attorney will create the necessary protective umbrella for me, and presumably your attorney will create a protective umbrella for you."
This is completely not true the next step is to design the means by which the test will be conducted the place the test will be conducted the associated equipment that will be used with the test to be conducted the proctors to the test that we will have conducted and how the public will both be able to participate in the test to be conducted and/or witness for themselves the test to be conducted those are some of the preliminary matters that remain to be resolved and these will be reviewed, discussed, negotiated and agreed upon here in public or otherwise your $25,000 USD offer is ovbiously not sincere and you have undertaken the means to extricate yourself so which is it. Do you want to discuss this plan here or move it into the shadows and darkness where you can "chicken" out and then blame the outcome on someone other than yourself?

geoffkait"An old philosopher once said, never go test something at someone else’s system. You might not like what you hear"
I am unafraid I will test cable directionality no problem and donate my $25K USD winnings to charity lets see if gdhal means business or is just another winkly dinkler!

gdhal"I’ll leave it for the court of public opinion to decide who means business"
Of course you will leave it to the court of public opinion that is exactly why I insisted from the beginning that all discussions regarding your "challenge" be conducted publically in this forum where you first proposed your "challenge" and not in secret except for those matters that are truly appropriate and proper to keep confidential such as account numbers and like matters. Anytime you want to resurrect your "challenge" please feel free to offer it again in public and I will accept provided that it remain in public which is what I insisted on from the beginning for reasons which I stated and if you do that I hope you will first research how a proper double-blinded test must be conducted so that we don't have to waste time resolving that issue first because as others have pointed out it is clear you do not understand proper double-blinded test protocols and methodologies.

gdhal"I appreciate your contacting me via PM. I believe it fair to write that you and I are at an impasse. Your refusal to skype first and foremost and insistence that we publicize here on the forum what in my view is personal means that we have “irreconcilable differences”. I thank you for your interest."

I made it clear from the beginning that this challenge should be conducted in public and that includes the design, terms, conditions, methodology and location of the test. You then not only insisted on first conducting discussions privately via skype but you also sought to engage me in a  private discussion as to the other terms of the test rendering whatever we would have decided to be dubious in value because it would have lacked input from the interested parties here which is who you initially engaged when first you proposed this challenge. You have also shown previously in this thread as has been pointed out by others that you do not know how to conduct a proper, reliable, repeatable test, or a double-blinded test at all meaning that it would have been impossible for me to satisfy your terms and conditions so I must say that I do not think you're challenge was ever intended to be taken seriously but rather was another effort to raise again the "it all sounds the same and if you believe otherwise you have to conduct a double-blinded test the onus is on you to conduct that test" argument which is patent nonsense.

Yes of course this is another example of a proper, scientific, verifiable, and repeatable excercise that could be replicated by others' who are genuinely interested in exploring the audibility of differences between cables in a Music Reproduction System and those who question such an outcome are suggested to do as you have done and perform there own research before asserting they're beliefs in this forum as though they had scientific validity. 

It is immediately apparrant for even a casual reader of the forum to correctly conclude that gdhal attempted to perpetrate a fraud upon the Audiogon community of audiophiles and the many posts of his that have been deleted by the moderators further support this simple observation. I am grateful to the dedicated, alert and well informed staff for taking action to prevent gdhal from defrauding someone of good faith of 10's of thousands of dollars and this is why I insisted with him that all discussion  of his "challenge" would be in public because it would expose him. What is a rather strange aspect of his extortion-fraud effort  is that it was attempted to have been executed under the cloak of "science" and exploration intended to reveal "truth" when really it was an outright fraud the very type of deception so many of these self-proclaimed "scientists" here accuse others of with their frequent accusations of "snake oil" against those who can hear differences in cables!

gdhalI’m in the U.S. (Long Island specifically) and I am referring to U.S. dollars. $25K is acceptable, but my preference would be half that. Keep in mind you and I would incur attorneys fees as well... I’ll await your PM.

$25K USD is fine however you have issued a public challenge so all negotiations must be in public so that we can settle this matter for once and for all! I will travel to US at my expense well it will be your expense this is not a hard matter to prove even though so many scream snake oil!

gdhal"Would you say that wire is directional? And, if you answer yes, would you say you could *hear* a difference if connected one direction or another?If you answer yes to both, I have a business proposition - directly related to this thread - for you (or anyone who answers yes to both questions for that matter). Broadly, the proposition involves either a blind or double blind test where it is my position that you *cannot* reliably hear a difference, and it would be your position that you could reliably hear a difference. If interested, and if the amount is worthwhile (low five figures?) we can have our attorney’s draw up the contracts, establish an escrow account and so on."

Are we talking USD here when you reference "low five figures"" If so, would $25,000 USD be acceptable to you? I believe you are in the US so this would involve air travel to me you need to make this worthwhile I will probably donate my money to a good cause after I complete your test. We would each put this money as cash into escrow to insure payment!

gdhalThe idea of meeting with your first via skype is so I can gain a sense as to whether or not we could ever attain an agreement.

I am increasingly developing the sense here that your proposal to discuss via skype now is in truth an attempt to escape from your $25K USD offer to test my ability to detect wire directionality in a scientifically controlled test. If the purpose is truly to determine whether we can ever actually agree on the protocols for the test then that is a conversation we can have here under the "protective umbrella " and watchful eye of all here on Audio and including Audiogon itself. We will each I am confident have specific requirements and preconditions for this test and it will be up for each forum participant here to conclude for theirselves whether such requirements are prudent and/or reasonable or an attempt to escape our committments as previously expressed here in the forum. As facts presently stand we have only your offer of $25,000 USD on the table and increasingly your adding additional preconditions onto your previously open offer. Everyone here should know that I am willing to travel to your country and accept your offer of $25,000 USD to detect this directionality but of course I will need assurances that the test will be conducted in a scientific way and in public so that others can witness what transpires.

gdhal"You don’t have to. Unless of course you wish to take me up on my challenge and have an opportunity to win some gold."
I am very pleased to see that you are again offering your $25,000 challenge to those who compete in  your test of audio cables. Because you are making this offer the burden is on you to provide the specific terms of the offer and the means under which this test will be conducted and those means should be reviewed in public here by the forum members to insure that there is no fraud on your part after all you have promised $25,000 at stake!

gdhalm"There is no need to take clearthink’s garbled words for it."

There is no need for anyone to take my word for it unlike you I suggest people conduct they’re own scientific, verifiable, repeatable double-blinded listening tests. The thoughtful and purposeful decision’s of this forum’s moderators to repeatedly delete your posts and provocations is all the proof anyone in this forum should reasonably require to decisively conclude that the undeniable proof is that your $25,000 USD listening "challenge" was a patent fraud and extortion which makes you a fraud or as another contributor observed here in a published and undeleted post a "con." I also note for the benefit of other’s here that you have continued your efforts to pursue your fraudulent test by privately messaging me through Audiogon seeking a skype conversation even though I have already explained to you I will not engage you in private conversation but instead insist that all communications be here in the public forum so that you can be revealed for the fraud that your $25,000 USD challenge is.