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EL34s -- your picks for best?

I recently replaced my JJ El34's with a set of NOS Siemens. Amazing difference.

To summarize, the differences were clarity in the upper frequencies, also presentation of the upper frequencies, general clarity, mid-range smoothness, bass speed and punch, and many improvements in the soundstage. For example, the depth and width improvements were obvious from the moment I put the Siemens tubes in. Also, timbre and air improved. I guess my conclusion is that everything improved substantially.

I keep the JJ's for casual listening, like when I listen to cd's while doing housework. But when I want to really listen, I put the Siemens tubes in and spin a record.

My system: VPI Mark IV, Alphason HRS-100, Alpha Genesis 1000 (I am saving for having my Koetsu Black re-done), Micromega Stage 3 cd, Fisher 400c or Dynaco Pas-3x (modified), Dynaco ST70 (modified), 1960's Sherwood FM tuner, Kef 102 Reference speakers (I am saving for a pair of Quad ESL-63's), Kimber 4TC bi-wired speaker cables, various interconnects, including 0.5m Krell Silver from amp to pre-amp. The cartridge is wired directly to the pre-amp via Cardas tonearm wire -- I replaced the tonearm wire with it and made it long enough to connect directly to the pre-amp. It is shielded, of course.

I was surprised at how much better the NOS power tubes sounded over the current production ones. Granted, I know that JJ EL34's are cheapies; but this much of a difference?

I am interested in anyone's experiences with EL34's in their system. Either comparing NOS to current production tubes, or with comparing different brands of NOS, or current production tubes amongst each other.

I have been told by a fellow Audiogoner to try the Winged C EL34's because he considers them to be the best sounding current production ones. I trust his judgement; he has a lot of experience, and golden ears, but I would like to also hear about more experiences with EL34's.

I really was (pleasantly) surprised with the differences the Siemens NOS tubes made. I have posted about my observations in the past with the differences between some 12ax7's. I also found the differences startling!

Thanks!
bicycle_man

Showing 4 responses by bicycle_man

bicycle_man OP
100 posts
 
Hi Rodman,
Thanks for your input! It was you who had recommended I try the Winged 'C' EL34's. I saw the Siemens/RFT EL34's on Audiogon at an incredibly good price so I jumped on them. I was looking for some Winged 'C' ones at the time. I will certainly try them when I need the next set of EL34's for my amp.

I have the set of 1965 Telefunken 12ax7's that came with my pre-amp. They are great tubes, but I prefer the sound of Bugle Boy or Mullard 10M's to the Telefunken's in my PAS-3x. I have not tried tube-rolling in my Fisher pre-amp.

Are the Siemens ECC83's Telefunkens? Are they synonymous?
bicycle_man OP
100 posts
 
Hi Rodman,
That's interesting. It could be.

With the JJ's in the amp, I had the same preferences. Although mine are EL34's, and not E34L's. I think they are two different models.

I felt that the bass was cleaner and more palpable with the Siemens. I know that statement should be qualified with stating the fact that the ST70 is poor with bass performance. I also found there was more upper octave detail coming through with them compared to the JJ's. I will pay more attention to the midrange on further comparison. My initial thoughts were that it was smooth.

By the way, my cartridge, which is also considered to be lean is wired directly into a step-up transformer, and not directly into the pre-amp.
bicycle_man OP
100 posts
 
Hi Rodman,
I am using Bugle Boy 12ax7's in the phono stage, a pair of Sylvania 12at7's in what I presume is the line stage, a 7025 the I cleaned off long ago and therefore don't know the brand, and it has a single Bugle Boy 12at7 on th right side in front. The BB's in the phono stage were NOS. The ubes all test well, and are not excessively hissy.

I replaced the original Wima caps with some polystyrenes that I had on hand. The Wimas were dead. I don't know the brand of the polystyrenes; they are new ones that I had left over from engineering school. I probably could gain sound quality by replacing them with higher quality ones.

Apart from the very expensive teflon V-caps and Audio Note caps, what is your preference for signal caps? Have you heard Mundhorfs?
bicycle_man OP
100 posts
 
I didn't know that teflon caps take a long time to burn-in. Makes sense, though.

I replaced the tin can ps cap with SDS Labs' latest Dynaco ps cap board. It also replaces the bias supply caps. The electrolytics it uses are Chemicon. They are bypassed by Wima; I am not sure if they are polystyrene or polypropylene.

I felt that this improved bass authority and tightened it up a considerable. It still has a way to go -- I am thinking of trying Van Alstine's bandwidth limiting input filter mod and upping the value of the coupling caps.

I agree in thinking that the ps is much more in the signal path than is given credit.

Thanks for the reply! I enjoyed it!

Here is a link to an article on capacitors I found interesting. Of course, it is the author's opinion, not mine. I have not tried any of these caps. Never-the-less, I found it to be interesting reading.
http://www.vhaudio.com/21capacitorshootout.pdf
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