Does a Good 20 amp cable Make a Difference

I'll echo the sentiments of many of the above posters - but will add...
- yes - a good power cable on the power filter is a must
- a heavier gauge may or may not yield better results
- an advanced cable architecture, like the Shunyata Venom will probably yield better results.

I have tried many different cable geometries over the last couple of years and the top performers have been ...
- Braided Geometries, such as used by Anti Cables, which are pretty good from what I have read here
- Spiral Geometries, which the Shunyata Venom appears to be, which might provide the best overall performance.

I will add that I have not tried the cables mentioned above, simply because I build my own cables from scratch, but I have experimented with those very same geometries.

Gauge should only a factor if you have
- many source components plugged into the filter, or
- the power cable is used for high current draw amps

My system uses a NAIM 5i 50 watt amp and for that 12AWG is ample, but for 100watts or higher 10 awg and even 7 awg for 250 watts might need to be considered

As proof of the effectiveness of the more advanced geometries - a friend brought one of his conventional power cables over, which I then rebuilt in a braided geometry. So, same conductors, same connectors - just a different way of positioning the individual conductors...
- The results were a noticeably quieter noise floor, improved dynamic performance and wider and more detailed image when used on the very same source component - his words, not mine.

Personally - I make my own PC's in the Spiral Design and have compared and prefer them to cables using silver/copper alloys costing as much as $1500 for a 5ft cable. (see my "System" link below for details)

As for the exotic materials - all of my power cables are copper - no fancy alloys or silver - just some very good quality copper from Furutech and DH Labs

Hope this helps

Czarivey - if your comments pertain to my post, then I guess the point I was trying to make is...
- simply moving up to a larger gauge will often do little to improve performance unless you are dealing with a high current draw devices.
- however, based on my experiences, my investing in a different geometry resulted in significantly better overall system performance.

Shuyata Venom and Anti-cables are two that I know of that are reasonably priced and incorporate a more advanced geometry which results in a lower noise floor, providing better clarity and dynamics.

They "should" provide better performance, but like anything else in this hobby - ya never know until you try them.

One cable that I have tried and believe may provide better performance over the Shuyata Diamond Back is the Signal Cable Silver Revelation - it is a very competent performer considering it's modest price - beating out my Furutech 10 gauge performance for dynamics, image and clarity.

I hope you all find this post more useful

My previous post was a bit verbose and more geared to DIY brethren :-)

Apologies for that ;-)

Cz - your statement "ROI in power cable is always worst"

In general, I would agree with that, since many companies still utilize a more standard cable architecture and use pretty poor connectors, especially in their entry-mid level products.

But having experimented with several different architectures and materials on my own DIY Power Cables over the last couple of years I now believe that there are a few companies that utilize either braided or spiral architectures such as Anti Cables and Shunyata which would possibly provide a significantly better ROI.

For example - one experiment I tried involved braiding the conductors of a Signal Cable Silver Resolution PC - this change alone resulted in it providing faster dynamic performance, deeper bass with more control, more clarity and wider/deeper image.

Another thing that I tried that did provide more details and punch was my choice of connectors...
- Vanguard Connectors with Gold Plated Copper contacts - were pretty good to start with
- But Sonar Quest connectors with silver plated copper contacts were noticeably better and now my only choice.

Both can be obtained from Ebay for a reasonable price and even when placed on the Silver Resolution power cable provided an audible improvement again.

Other members have found the Furutech/Oyaide brands provide very good improvements, but I'm all about "bang for the buck" and they are just too rich for my wallet :-)

Replacing the wall outlets with Pass and Seymour MRI grade outlets provided surprising improvements to dynamics and image.

So - combining improvements to power cable architecture + connectors + MRI outlets has resulted in a significantly better audio performance - i.e. from just the "power side" of my system - and as it turns out - it had a pretty good ROI to boot :-)

I do concede that my DIY approach does give me an advantage in that I can build to a specific geometry with select parts, but there are some companies out there that do provide very high quality leading edge power cable designs that perform to a very high level for a pretty reasonable price.

Regards...

Zyac39 - not having experienced Cardas Power cables I am unable to provide any value as to their capabilities.

Information on the Cardas Golden pcs architecture seems a little sketchy at best, since I have found multiple architectures for the same cable on the web. There also appears to be several counterfeit versions out there, so I would stay away from a second hand Cardas cable unless I was VERY sure of it's origin.

I think I would have to stay with Shunyata and Anti-cables for "Bang for the Buck" and of course, Nordost for a TOTL solution.

I have heard first hand the difference Nordost Power Cables can make, so I have confidence in their abilities - they are just a little pricey and they may also have counterfeit versions out there, so beware of resales.

Another interesting looking cable architecture similar to Anti Cables, is from Less Loss - which should perform better than most cables having conventional architectures. They seem to receive very good feedback from most users, but again, a little on the pricey side

Regards...

Max - I watched the review you posted (most of it) and the one thing that stood out for me was that the reviewer seemed to think that he should be hearing improvements that another person had experienced.

He talked of not being able to hear an appreciable improvement in dynamics the other person believed he should be getting.

Unfortunately, his system was probably not identical to the other person's system, so how could they hear similar improvements?

One thing I have learned over the last few years is - your system will only perform as well as your worst component or cable will allow - i.e. the weakest link!

So if your interconnect does not provide a good dynamic performance, then adding a great power cable to an amp will probably not yield any significant benefits in that area either.

This is unfortunately the issue with replacing any cables in a system. For example - I recently had the opportunity to test some extremely good IC's and speaker cables - I tried the interconnects first and found they provided little in the way of improvements, but when I connected the speaker cables as well I instantly heard appreciable improvements across the board. The issue was my speaker cables were not allowing the extremely fine details being conveyed to/by the amp and IC combo, to be passed on to the speakers.

We tend to report improvements (or disappointments) on the latest cable (or component) we have just installed and don't consider that many of the changes experienced (or not) may actually due to other cables and components in our system.

Power cables are perhaps the most contentious cable related topic of all, since people have reported widely varying success and there is no hard and fast rule for the cable selection process.

Zyac39...

I do know that well designed power cables make for some considerable improvements and from that perspective if I had to recommend one of the three cables I have mentioned - I would probably go with the Shunyata, only because they "appear" to share similar design principles to my own DIY cables and other members have posted some very positive comments about them.

In addition - I have heard several Nordost power cable products and they all offered appreciable improvements - so if you want a "guarantee" - get a Nordost.

HOWEVER, the system they demo'd those PC's in probably had extremely good IC and SC's - so you should not use my comments as a gauge as to their effectiveness in YOUR system.

If you find it does not "impress", then I would urge you to take a look at the other cables in your system before selling the PC's off at a loss - it could be your IC's or SC's are not performing up to the capabilities of the rest of your system/cables!

My experiences with power cables were very positive and this led me to upgrade what I refer to as my "Power Corridor" i.e. the wiring from the mains breaker panel, the wall outlets, power distribution box and of course all power cables.

With that out of the way I then moved my attention to SC's and IC's (in that order) knowing that the power side was no longer my weakest link.

One last comment - todays components tend to perform to an extremely high level of fidelity and as such are seldom the weakest link, but they do need good cables, especially power cables in order to achieve their very best.

As an example - my DAC cost around $400, but when connected with excellent cables (costing several times its price) it performs to a very much higher higher level of fidelity.

I have also experienced similar benefits by applying "power supply improvements" to other modestly priced components over the years

If possible, audition the cables first or deal with companies that allow full refunded returns.

Sorry I could not be of more assistance, but if you have any further questions please ask.

Regards...

Zyac39 - what are you planning on plugging into the power conditioner?

If the amp is not going into the conditioner you may only need 15 amp cable.

What make/model is the conditioner?

I have all my low current devices into a power distribution box - the amp goes into the wall.

I didn't notice any difference between a 13 gauge and a 10 gauge power cord connecting the distribution box to the wall. Both were identical architecture and quality of materials.

There was only marginally less bass when I put the same 13 gauge PC on the amp - a 50 watt NAIM 5i - not a huge current draw

Regards

ZY - OK - but what plugs into the conditioner ?

The amp(s) or just source components?

Thanks

Zy - if I had your investment in Shuyata products I would personally keep with them.

The Black Mamba HC CX would be a good choice for outlet to the power filter link and from the power filter to your amp

You could try buying just one to start with and try it...
- first on the power filter
- then on the amp.

Depending on the current draw of your amp - the existing power cable my be more than adequate.

Personally, I plug my amp directly into the wall outlet - which is a dedicated line with Pass and Seymour MRI grade outlets - they clamp like a vice.

Regards...