2. amps-preamps
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Can pro amps possibly sound good? Crown, QSC, etc

I have been looking into pro amps for a to-be-built HT/music room. Recently I came across an old review in The Stereo Times: The Complete Audiophile Magazine, which reviewed 2 discontinued Crown amps, the K2 and the Studio Reference I. The K2 the reviewer thought "not distinguished or especially musically refined", but the Studio Ref he thought an EXCELLENT full-range amp. It does have some amazing specs:

Signal-to-Noise (A-weighted) below rated full bandwidth power: 120 dB.
Damping Factor: >20,000 from 10 Hz to 400Hz.
780WPC into 8 ohms, 1160WPC into 4 ohms.

The review is here.

From what I've found so far, there are possbile downsides to using pro gear in an otherwise consumer setup, but in my case I think these are non-issues:

-fan noise: not an issue for me since I will have an equipment closet. Won't have to do a "fan mod".

-ugly: again, not an issue for me with an equipment closet

-hum: I believe not an issue as long as I use balanced interconnects from the prepro. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

-expects pro-level input levels: I think not an issue if the amp has dip switches or gain controls?

And yet, over on a couple of AVS forum threads, I actually got asked to leave when I started suggesting pro amps. It seems as though some of the audiophiles there (and the same guys might be over here) don't even want to hear about a class of gear which imo just MIGHT sound good. It just isn't worth "polluting" an audiophile thread. Am I missing some other downside to pro amps, other than the above pints? Were these guys attitudes based on something substantive and audibly detectable, or just a form of audio bigotry?

I'm not saying all pro amps are going to be great (for instance I know the Behringer A500 is lousy), but might there be some good stuff too, like QSC DCA, or Crown Macro Reference (other suggestions would be welcome)?
syswei
auxinput
2,920 posts
 

I have had experience with Crown amps of both Class AB and Class I (modified Class D) variety.  The Crown pro amps are very nice, but they are built to be able to push a lot of watts and be very durable.  The CTS600, which was a Class AB amp, was very good, but it sounded somewhat dry.  The CTS200, which was Class I and an evolution of the original Crown K2 amp, sounded good and has good bass strength, but had tube-like overtones in the sonic signature.

In both cases, my Channel Island D200 Class D amps and Emotiva monoblocks were significant improvements in sound quality.

Pro amps have their place is live audio and abusive environments, but I don't think they will ever take the place of true audiophile amplifiers.

wolf_garcia
6,608 posts
 
I use thousands of watts in a live show, 12 single ended tube amp watts per side for my hifi rig (well…not counting my subs).
adrummingdude
3 posts
 
Count me among those who use both pro and consumer amps. In my office 2 channel rig I have a cheap Crown whatever (A/B topology) driving a pair of LS50's, and couldn't be happier with the sound. In fact, to prove a point at my local hifi shop, I brought that amp in for a shootout between it and the new Anthem STR integrated, which is what, $4000 or so? We both concluded that there MIGHT be a difference, but certainly not one that reconciles the nearly 20x cost difference.

In my experience with home theater, the biggest difference between pro and consumer amps is that the latter are a bit trickier to integrate with a consumer setup. The gain staging is different, the connectors are all different, triggering is different, etc. I actually use both consumer and pro amps in my HT rig, with a Halo A31 powering the front three, and another cheap Crown whatever (I bought the two of them from some guy for $300 total) for the surrounds. I run everything XLR from my Anthem processor, but I still have to go around to my rack, which is in an adjacent room, to turn on the Crown. I've been considering getting a triggered outlet to plug it in to.
corrupted
3 posts
 
This is the only topic i could find googling. and still very interesting. So do not delete this topic.
Long time ago i was using for a QSC RMX 850 paired with ProAc bookshelf. and i was pleased and i though i had a very good setup because i had good audiophile speakers.. until one day i found a Cambridge Azur...After switching the amps i noticed the difference almost instantly. The sound was better with the Azur.. So the Azur replaced my bulky, heavy and ugly QSC RMX 850.

recently i sold my QSC RMX850 for $100 bucks in a good working condition. because i need cash badly... So before selling it, i had to do a quick test to make sure it was still working..but i tested it on a B&W floorstanding which i didn’t have when i had the QSC.. so it was the first time for the QSC to be paired with the B&W...

You know what! i think i regret it now. because the QSC really sounded great on my B&W floorstanding speakers.But it was too late... the QSC was sold i had the buyer coming..

The reason i did not keep it is because that QSC did not sound great with my Proac Bookshelf .. my Cambridge Azur 640 which i hate for having low quality china parts offers a noticeable better sound when paired with proac.But when the Cambridge is paired with the B&W floorstanding speakers which has bass/mid/tweet drivers.. the sound is just muffed.. clean vocal but muffed bass with the Cambridge Azur amp.
Definitely not as good as the QSC RMX850 paired with B&W.When i use the QSC RMX850 paired with B&W floorstanding speakers.. the sound quality just goes live.. something i couldn’t get with the Cambridge.
So my guess is that it all depends of the match we do Amp+Speakers
QSC with proac bookshelf (1000$ speakers) = okay sound but not audiophile. (proac bookself are audiophile bookshelf that has no real bass regardless of the amp)

QSC with B&W floorstanding std7nt ($800 speakers) = nice sounding!
Cambridge Azur 640 with Proac bookshelf = clean and audiophile grade (entry level audiophile) The sound is slightly better than with a QSC.

Cambridge Azur 640 with B&W floorstanding = It is nah...clean vocal but muffed bass..no life... near horrible unless you crank the volume up..
So are Pro amps better than Audiophile Amps ? my guess is that it is a Yes and No depends on your setup and your taste..
If you are looking for a particular sound quality you may find it in a Mcintosh or a Devialet or you could also find that type of sound in a pro amp.
I did not change the fan of the QSC as i don’t like messing with voltage.. did not want to burn my house.. But all i know is that pro amp like the QSC offer a pretty good sound and the difference is slim.. A Mcintosh amp is like $6000 and devialet start at $8000 and when paired with equal grade speakers , i find that they sound better than any pro gear i’ve tried.
but am i willing to spend 20k to get only twice the quality of a $1000 pro gear settup. Sure not unless i win lottery or something.
The second reason i choose not to keep pro gear is the ease of use.With pro gear you have to do everything manually.. change the volume, turn on/off by hand etc...With todays modern Audiophile amps, it is all done by remote and some now also offer iphone/smartphone control to access NAS or streaming services.. it is much more friendly...
But if you are looking for party setup with good quality sound and have a limited budget and not looking for modern functions.. Pro amp with floorstanding audiophile speakers is a good option to try..


brayeagle
362 posts
 
Agree with dave_72

Bryston has made pro amps for years, with amps of varying power requirements. Their 4B and 7 series can drive any of the currently-available production HEA speakers.
I'm using a 4BSST2 to drive my Thiel 2.7 speakers. Never been happier. 
And their amps come with a 20 year warranty. 



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