To DAC or not to DAC

I've been busy since this morning. I was able to get my hands on a Cambridge unit to try out as well.

I spent a couple of hours going back and forth listening to some of Cyndi Lauper's slower stuff. I like her voice, but it can be shrill sometimes and can wear on you. The selections that I listened to also have some nice bass in them.

In the end I found that the V-Dac is not for me. What I initially perceived as more highs turned out to be too much of a good thing and listening this afternoon proved the V-Dac to make long term listening a hard thing to do with this sort of material. I also found that using the V-Dac made the use of a sub woofer necessary. There was no way that I could do without it. The V-Dac just seemed to suck the low end out of my system.

The Cambridge just left me unimpressed. It was smoother than the V-Dac and the bass was better than the V-Dac, but in my system, it was kind of like the XDA-1, but less so.

With the XDA-1, I got no shrillness, no matter how loud I played it. It was just plain more comfortable to listen to. There is also the matter of the bass. I've heard the bass characteristics of the XDA-1 described as bloated. I don't find that to be the case. In my system, I find it to be where it needs to be and I've spent much of my time listening to my system with the sub turned off.

In the end, the XDA-1 just made music more fun to listen to, not to mention that it has six inputs and a remote. Apparently I'm going to have to spend a lot more money to get something better than the XDA-1 and up sampling isn't necessarily something that is needed.

For reference purposes, my system consists of:

NAD C162 pre
Emotiva XDA-1 DAC
Sonos
Sony CD
Aragon 2004 amp
System Audio SA505 speakers
REL T3 sub crossed over at 55 or so hz.
All Blue Jeans interconnects and speaker cables made of Canare 4S11 cable.

BTW, I've just gotta mention that I love the little SA505s. For a 10" tall speaker they eat up everything that the Aragon can pump to them and they make a lot of music. I don't miss my 685s at all.

Tony,

To get better sound quality than your current DAC, you're going to have to up the budget a good amount, as I'm assuming you just found out. I haven't heard your DAC, but I've heard a lot about it. I've heard the V-DAC and DACMagic many times. At this level, you'll get different, not better. Different can be better matched to your system, ears, etc., but there's going to be tradeoffs like you've mentioned.

If you want a solid improvement without tradeoffs (relative to what you've got), I'd look at the $1k new retail DACs. Used will cost you less than that, but I think you know the usual suspects - Rega, W4S, Eastern Electric, MDHT, etc.

I posted this experience over on AA. A friend who's been using a new and very popular USB DAC found what looks like a DIY DAC housed in a generic aluminum chassis dated 2005. My friend says the output stage seems way over built.

By comparison this old DAC with one coaxial input sounds noticeably better than the modern design.

Musical Fidelity's V-DAC II might be a perfect example. An asynchronous 24bit 192kHz USB DAC under $500 seems to be the current goal. While the V-DAC II now passes 192kHz through its USB input I still question their definition of asynchronous.

Unfortunately, the ability to make these claims does not automatically mean it's going to actually sound good. As with many of the components we already use the overall circuit design and the analog output stage have a great deal to do with the sound of a DAC. Tonyangel seems to have found out first hand that there's no free lunch.

The one thing I lose sight of is that 99% of my digital listening will be of ripped CD's which are 16-41kHz limited just how important is the future of hi-res downloading to me.

Not exactly in the sub $1K DAC market but some interesting reviews regarding overall sound quality.

nekoaudio.com
http://dhost.info/mhdtlab/

Not trying to steal your thread but was wondering if any of you have compared the DacMagic to the PS Audio DL III?

Vicdamone,

A lot of people focus on the chip being used - especially if it's an ESS Sabre chip - and asynch. The power supply and output stages are critical in a DAC. I own an old Theta Cobalt DAC that's about 15 years old. Using coax or optical and redbook files, it sounds quite a bit better than these entry level DACs. People keep saying digital gets far better everyday, and I think it's a load of crap. The Theta DAC was a sub $1k DAC back then. The power supply is pretty big for a DAC, and their are no op-amps.

I think the only areas where newer DACs have seperates themselves from the older ones are jitter reduction, high-res capability, and USB input. High-res is gaining more and more titles, but hardly anywhere near contending with redbook. I highly doubt high-res will be mainstream and/or the standard any time soon. People get way too hung up on it.

The budget DACs all have wall wart power supplies and op-amps. IMO it doesn't matter what features/gimmics they have. In the DAC, the digital bits get turned into analog. Just as in amps or CD players, better power supplies and output stages flat out sound better.

No such thing as a free lunch, indeed.