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Up to the Minute: Streaming Bits to Audiophile DAC

I have some unanswered questions from another thread, and also some new ones despite searching the archives. So I hope this thread might be a good place for all of us who are interested in state of the art audio quality from hard disk drive based files.

Kublakhan in another thread suggested using the Sweetwater Creation Stations as hardware for a PC based audio solution and so far this gear looks pretty good to me.

My questions, however, arise from the fact that there may be some disconnect between the conventions for "pro audio" and "audiophile" audio.

So as of this writing, can anyone please explain:

Why does every pro audio person seem confused when I tell them I want to use an external DAC?

What is the BEST way to extract bit for bit data from a hard drive, to export to an audiophile DAC?

Why oh why do expensive $$$ music or media servers, which are supposedly configured to optimize audio use, nonetheless require some sort of cheapo "interface" to stream the data into an audiophile DAC?

Why on earth would I want to buy an audiophile "sound card", which I presume (in addition to an "interface") also has its own DAC?

Given the options which are available for "sound card" and/or "interface" type devices, what is the BEST way to tap the bitstream and/or maximize performance of the audiophile DAC? Optical? TOSLINK? Spdif?

Given the choices I might have for the "interface" between the computer and the DAC, what is the BEST way to minimized "jitter" or other audiophile nasties? Or is that phenomenon more of a downstream issue AFTER the bitstream hits the DAC?

There is a lot of great information in the other threads about ripping, tagging, Foobar vs Itunes and a million other complications of hard drive based audio.

But for now, I would really appreciate just some basic, conclusive opinions on the best way to get bits off the hard drive and safely on their way to my speakers from an audiophile DAC.

Please advise.

THANK YOU.
cwlondon

Showing 9 responses by cwlondon

cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
Now that a few more months have passed....

could anyone please update this thread on experiences you have had streaming digital bits to an audiophile quality DAC?

In the end, I decided to not buy the Sweetwater Creation station:

one sweetwater rep suggested it wouldnt make a great all around PC

still, it would require an "interface" to get the data stream into a DAC

any new ideas, please?

any new candidates for I2S DACs?
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
MAK

Finally, someone is making a lot of sense - thank you.

Could you give more detail, please on how we get the bits from the PC to the DAC without using a soundcard.

An "interface"(?) What connections, cables etc could I order when building my own PC?

What is the cost no object, best audiophile solution to then use the external DAC of your choice?
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
I want to do this with MY OWN DAC.

Need help. Please continue.
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
Well the increasingly heated debate here suggest to me that this puzzle still isn't solved.

I am still frustrated and confused as to why we cant export bit perfect WAV files from a well built custom computer into an audiophile DAC and otherwise FORGET all these cheapo sound cards, crap power supplies, jitter inducing processes and arcane acronyms built that I associate with mass produced plastic computers.

As this is supposed to be an "up to the minute" thread...please do continue.

Anyone?

Does the Benchmark DAC work well for this now? Or does it need "mods"? WHy does it need "mods"?

Is the Zanden "pricey like hell" because it is some weird tweako hand made limited production voodoo product and/or one of the few in the world that happens to have IS2?

Are the bigger manufacturers of DACs not listening? Why wouldnt every DAC maker in town be thinking that the world is starting to use hard drives for music and maybe it might be worth a second thought and the extra 50 cents to add an IS2 output to their 5 figure high margin DACs?

I rarely like digital music of any kind, so this set up is more for convenience and archival purposes than trying to outperform my Rockport reference turntable.

Again, if anyone knows how to export a WAV file bit stream into a reasonably priced decent performing DAC without a lot of extra steps and garbage, either electronically or scientifically, or placing a special order to some garage manufacturer who never answers his phone, please let us know.

Cheers

Cwlondon
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
Well the increasingly heated debate here suggest to me that this puzzle still isn't solved.

I am still frustrated and confused as to why we cant export bit perfect WAV files from a well built custom computer into an audiophile DAC and otherwise FORGET all these cheapo sound cards, crap power supplies, jitter inducing processes and arcane acronyms that I associate with mass produced plastic computers.

As this is supposed to be an "up to the minute" thread...please do continue.

Anyone?

Does the Benchmark DAC work well for this now? Or does it need "mods"? WHy does it need "mods"?

Is the Zanden "pricey like hell" because it is some weird tweako hand made limited production voodoo product and/or one of the few in the world that happens to have IS2?

Are the bigger manufacturers of DACs not listening? Why wouldnt every DAC maker in town be thinking that the world is starting to use hard drives for music and maybe it might be worth a second thought and the extra 50 cents to add an IS2 input to their 5 figure high margin DACs?

I rarely like digital music of any kind, so this set up is more for convenience and archival purposes than trying to outperform my Rockport reference turntable.

Again, if anyone knows how to export a WAV file bit stream into a reasonably priced decent performing DAC without a lot of extra steps and garbage, either electronically or scientifically, or placing a special order to some garage manufacturer who never answers his phone, please let us know.

Cheers

Cwlondon
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
Cokorody and Steve N

Thanks for the observations.

Now where do we stand on best execution, please?
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
Can anyone please give a quick, up to the minute update on streaming bits to an audiophile DAC?

Yesterday, I took a trip to BH Photo in New York which is always an adventure.

Their "Pro Audio" guy on staff came highly recommended and for the first minute or so seemed like he knew exactly what he was talking about when it came to hard drive based audio and uncompressed, bit for bit WAV files.

As we spoke, he pointed me towards a glass case full of reasonably expensive pro audio DACs, and also the Benchmark DAC 1 in a sleek, black rack mountable case, in stock for $995.

Unfortunately, it was all downhill from there, however, and he then had ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA how I would

1) rip my CDs to WAV files on the hard drive(s) of my choice

2) "tag" these WAV files with album and track information

3) export bit for bit perfect data without insulting my other components by using a cheesey cheap sound card or "interface"

4) implement "best execution" for connections, whether USB, XLR or some other acronym that I dont necessarily understand

and

5) Get all of this with a minimum amount of "jitter" or other nasty artifacts into the DAC of my choice.

From the DAC, I can handle things from there.

This guy looked at my like I was nuts, and even more so when I told him this was for only 2 (?!?!?) channels, despite his credentials as a Benchmark dealer.

So I am still confused and would greatly appreciate any up to the minute updates on this lively, timely topic.

Steve N I appreciate your technical comments, which may also be a bit over my head.

Could anyone put together an off the shelf list of components that I can go out and buy today to do this in a Windows environment?

Thank you.
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
http://cachepe.zzounds.com/media/quality,85/brand,zzounds/UCA202_big-c5c66c5ee06b3a89a1fe3b25a7ba0cb3.jpg

Can anyone guess what this interface does?

I still dont understand how I can plug a cheap device into my USB port and it somehow knows if I want to extract an analogue signal or stream bits.

Would the optical output stream bits?

In the case of an analogue signal (for example, the headphone output) would this thing look through to the DAC in my Sony VAIO laptop, or would it also have its own cheap DAC thrown in for the low low price of 30 bucks?

I started to write a new thread - "Streaming Bits for Dummies" but thought I should continue here.....

For the most part, I am still clueless.

Thank you.
cwlondon OP
1,210 posts
 
Hi Steve and thanks.

* So this thing will output SPDIF, but only through an optical output which is not best execution?

* Furthermore it is limited to 48khz?

* And the whole set up will be prone to jitter?

* And whatever problems you would also get from a cheap and noisy power supply?

Sounds like we are still in the dark ages for streaming bits to an audiophile DAC?
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