The Future of Audio Amplification
There's no stopping the Audiophile. I say Audiophile as opposed to HEA Audiophile. The audiophile mainstream is no longer associated with high price and heavy and is only going to increase in this direction, there's no turning back. I for one am thrilled, and say "about time". Well actually said "about time" in 1997 but if you talked like this back then it was too prophetic even though the insiders knew the change would have to come. Michael Green |
Did a MGA Tunable Room in Chicago and powering my Rev60 speakers was a tiny Class D amp. Tons of dynamics and extension on both ends. There are pictures of the setup on TuneLand, lots of fun. this is probably the truth I would agree "In the years to come they will get better, cheaper, and lighter. It will come to a point where only a fool or someone nostalgic will buy a heavy power sucking class A amp." Michael Green |
" Where are we at with class D right now? Everyone keeps saying that the future is class D but where is that in the future?" It's already here and has been for a few years. When the CES happens this year I'm not sure we will see any Class A amplifiers on the main floor, maybe not any at all. Don't quote me, I don't have an exhibitors list in front of me. What I do have is an apartment a few blocks away from the CES and have seen HEA, in general, go from cutting edge front and center to almost invisible at the biggest electronic show in the world. I don't think Kosst saying class D is a fad resonates much with innovative audio companies of today. I also don't think the current young generation of audiophiles care to see huge amplifiers sitting in the middle of their living rooms. I may be wrong, but I haven't seen this. A bunch of old farts, as we are, aren't going to tell the younger generation much about the way they are setting up their stereos. I'm not trying to offend but the OP says "future" not nursing home bencher audiophiles. Trying to say these massive space heaters are going to somehow become the future is not very realistic. I have many amplifiers, some dating back to the 60's. They're all enjoyable for one reason or another. I'm listening to one from the 70's as I write this. Even though I'm enjoying this amp I can hold in my hand this other little Class D amp and realize the truth. I can also setup this little Class D, tune it, and be right in line with my other amps. Now, I can choose any of my amps to listen to, but reality is reality. mg |
Yesterday I visited a friend’s house after I was invited to check out his new TV. The price tag was staggering, less than $800.00. The picture was gorgeous and I could stand way off to the side without any distortion (or very little). 72" screen I think he said, or was it 65", anyway it was big. We started talking about screens and price tags only a couple years back. Audio of course came up as he owns one of my systems and we talked about how audio has made huge changes as well. A little over a year ago he dumped his big high end system for my simple designing and the improvement was not small. In fact just one of his components paid for his whole new setup including his home theatre. He has made the comment, more then once, of how listening has become so less expensive then a few short years ago. Sometimes when I read here, it feels like the guy hanging on to his old tube 32" tv weighing back breaking amounts, that no one wants to help him remove, and he can barely give it away. The mentality behind hanging on to the heavy tv is very similar what HEA is going through today. Huge space heaters taking up floor space are going to continue to decrease no matter how much sentimental value our generation places on the good ole days of plug and play. In the future there is still going to be dedicated rooms, especially outside of the US where they take the time to dedicate and aren’t trying to living room-ize their audio system (which never really made sense). Here in the US though the path is clear and will remain steady on it’s course. Also let me say this. Picture yourselves being 25 years old now, in todays world. Your dedicated room is going to be a lot different from the way it was way back when. There are more dedicated rooms now then back when we were doing our thing. The major difference is, now they are called "dedicated gaming rooms". I have no doubt listening rooms are on the rise. But this is different from equipment collection rooms. Michael Green |
LOL, I had to go look up what an E-bike was, isn't that sad, I'm getting old or lazy lol. As far as A AB or D my favorite would be based on Tuning. That means, parts in a big heavy chassis? Nope, I can beat those up with a low mass amp of any type. Amps that have tons of dampening? Nope I want something I can apply variable tuning to. Amps with shielded transformers? Nope, I like open field designs. There are lot of criteria I have for amps A AB and D isn't one of them. JA measuring amps means zero to me. I'm more interested in his latest test equipment (JA is a test equipment junky, in a good way). Distortion? I haven't met anyone from this forum yet that deals with a well rounded view of distortion and the effects of. Lets see would that be effects or affects (wink). Here's a quick example. I walk into a listening room to listen with some guy talking about amp distortion and how he can hear it. Now we're standing in an untuned room and our breathing is at 10dB without anything else happening. He talks and I instantly can hear the room distorting, why and where. No music yet and we're at 55dB. So we turn on the music and I'm hearing all kinds of things happening that can and should be Tuned to give us the best soundstage for that recording, 65-95dB. Then after I do some tuning he's going to want me to tune it differently to his ears. What am I thinking about his claim to hear the difference in .02 distortion? Excuse me I have to use the bathroom and read my Stereophile :) Michael |
How old are you Ihasaguy? The question is not who is willing to buy today but who will be around tomorrow that thinks the Mac is as cool as it once was? I was a McIntosh dealer so don't get me wrong, but I saw the Mac buyer age right along with the product. McIntosh deserves to be one of the last guys standing but I seriously doubt any mega weight audio products are going to be here tomorrow. Any of them. That's just me speaking but that's also from the mouths of the designers themselves. mg |
Thank God Erik and Mapman showed up. I was starting to think I saw a horse & buggy go by. The resistance to innovation on this forum is frightening. People talking about things they've never listened to, others talking about measurements as if that is hearing. Some serious audio fruit loops going on around here. Happy New Year! I hope you guys stick around, it was getting a little scary. MG |
"There is a gap between a number and perception which you and kosst can't seem to grasp, but most can." As Sam Elliott says "exactly right". There's nothing wrong with being an engineer, and there's nothing wrong with taking measurements. However measurements and listening are two different items. Michael Green |
"are you listening to your self" Nope, I'm listening to music and working on folks' systems who have Class A, AB and D. No need to guess George when I'm doing. Oh, and since you mention roomtune, go ahead and type roomtune into a search engine. RoomTune started with me George. How do you think the hobby got the term room tuning. Look it up for yourself in TAS, Stereophile or any other audiophile magazine when they covered "RoomTune" from 1990 on. This is where you insert your snappy put down_________:) But just remember George those magazines have already been printed many years ago. It's call audio history. You don't have to like it, just like you don't have to like Class D amps. You also don't have to like me, but your missing out on a fun audio guy. http://www.michaelgreenaudio.net/ I think some guys here try to hard to be relevant and it causes them to become the opposite from what the hobby is and is about, the enjoyment of listening to music. I think most here have experience with A, AB and some D. And with that experience a respect is given to all the amp types. I personally think the OP is pretty clear. "the future of audio amplification" It's not a trick question, and it's not a put down for what any may like the most. Trying to tell all of us that we're going to someday see innovation stop, well that's simply not going to happen. I don't care if the next Class is W, innovation is the future. Michael Green |
Thanks for the link George. Seems like I may be a little more picky than the folks mentioned on that thread. For me that is. As I have mentioned before I, first of all, don’t like the sound of amps crammed into over built chassis, they sound to constricted (congested) to me. I also don’t like the sound of huge transformers too close to the other parts hosting the signal. I don’t like the way heatsinks distort and the list goes on. In general I don’t enjoy big heavy amps, of any type. I also don’t like listening to crossovers or damped speakers or garden hose wire. What I do like is low mass and variably tunable products. Since I use my systems as musical instruments, including the environment, I can see where my views may differ from others here. I can also see where my views might fit into the future of amps more than some here. I really only have two beefs on this forum and neither has to do with what someone likes or believes. My two beefs are internet trolls and folks who talk about stuff they haven't actually done. mg |
I'm happy to see this thread becoming more civil and moving toward the common good, that's awesome! This is such an important thread I was hoping this would happen. My part in this will be strictly listening and applying mechanics to the samples I receive. I have several amps in route to me now and several more being designed for me (Class D). In my listening so far I have found the same issue with Class D as I have with the other Classes, so for my listening I have removed the chassis. I am pro-fields not dampened fields. mg |
