2. amps-preamps
  3. 1377823658

Need Preamp Advice For Adding a Turntable

This is my first post on Audiogon, so please be gentle. Over the last several years I've been able to find the help that I've needed just searching through the forums, but now I could use advice specific to my system. I understand this is all subjective and everyone's hearing is different, I'm just hoping for a little shove in the right direction.

My system consists of:
Ayre K5xe mp Preamp
PS Audio PerfectWave DAC
PS Audio PerfectWave Transport
Theta Dreadnaught Amp
Vandersteen 5A Speakers

I'm pretty happy with the current sound, though, at times I've wondered if I could improve on it with a different preamp or possibly other tweaks. The Ayre is a great piece and I only mention changing it because it's been my experience that the preamp has the greatest affect on the sound. It's very easy to listen to, but I feel like something is missing. This may be due to previously having a tube preamp with class A mono blocks before having to move and go without a stereo for a couple of years. I've just recently finished piecing this system together so my ears haven't had a ton of time to adjust and I'm just happy to be able to play music again.

So now I'm hoping I can draw on other's experiences as to whether I should look into just adding a phono preamp to my current system, or go with a preamp with a built in phono stage or possibly replacing the Ayre K5xe mp with a separate line stage plus phono preamp that mate well together.

The type of sound that I enjoy is fairly neutral and transparent with a good amount of detail, a large soundstage with good separation and timbre with maybe a touch of bloom. Something musical and fairly accurate.

Features I'm looking for:
Solid State (have to integrate into HT, tubes a possibility)
Home Theater Pass Through
Fully Balanced
XLR and RCA inputs
Remote
Under $5K used

Preamp models I've read about, but have no experience:
Pass Labs XP-10 or XP-20
Parasound JC-2
Sim Moon
Aesthetix Calypso or Janus

Phono Preamps, also no experience with them:
Pass XP-15
Ayre P5xe
Aesthetix Rhea

I do enjoy what a nice tube preamp can add to a system, but am hoping to get as close as I can with a solid state preamp since it's going to be integrated with my HT and I don't want to burn up tubes watching movies and television. The phono preamp could be either tube or solid state. And my focus is on music and not HT even though I'm merging the two.

I appreciate any and all feedback on these models along with any other suggestions or advice that anyone may have to offer. And thank you for taking the time to read my post.
firsttoact

Showing 5 responses by zd542

zd542
5,339 posts
 
How many channels on your Theta are you using?
zd542
5,339 posts
 
The reason I ask is it looks like you are looking for an upgrade to get a little more out of your system, and the improvement doesn't necessarily, have to come in the form of a new preamp. Have you tried using 4 channels on your Model 5's? If you haven't, you may be in for a pretty big surprise. The Dreadnaught is a very underrated amp. It was designed by Charles Hanson from Ayre.

As far as a preamp goes, the one you have now is great. Not only is it a great preamp by itself, but its very well matched to the rest of the system. The K5 is a very hard component to out class, but given the quality of everything else in your system, you can justify an upgrade. For SS goes, you may be able to pick up a used K1. Even if its an older unit, you can always have it upgraded. That will pair very well with an Ayre P5 phono preamp.

For tubes, Aesthetix would definately be a top pick. Given the rest of your system, you can't go wrong. The only thing to consider is if you should go with a Calypso and a Rhea or a Janus. You'll be happy either way. Babybear mentioned the ARC Ref 3. I think that would definitely be a good choice too. Its a bit more lively than the Aesthetix. Its a faster sounding preamp with great pacing.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
At this point, I think it would be a good idea to try using 4 channels of your Theta on your 5's before you do anything. Its just a matter of changing some cables around. I can tell you it will probably make a big difference. For me, I considered the Theta but I ended up going with 2 Ayre V-5's instead. The point is the 2nd amp makes a big difference. That will tell you a lot about where you need to go. If it does work, though, you don't have to get another Dreadnaut for your surrounds and centre. If theatre isn't as important as music, you can get something else that will sound fine for far less money. That will still leave you open to something with your preamp and/or phono preamp. You are correct, though, the preamp is the heart of the system.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
"I'll definitely try bi-amping the Vandys with the Dreadnaught. It's a great suggestion and will be a fun experiment to see if I can hear a difference. Your set-up with the two Ayre V5s sounds like the way to go over the Theta with each channel having its own chassis to improve channel separation."

I wouldn't assume that the V-5's are better than your Theta. Both amps are very popular with Vandersteen. Its just a matter of what you like better. Some people prefer the Theta you have. As far at the biamping goes, its not so much to improve separation as it is to work the amps the same amount as possible. The 2 Ayre's I have are vertically biamped. I use 1 amp for each speaker, not 1 for the highs and 1 for the lows. Using 4 channels of your Theta is basically the same thing. I don't think having the 4 channels in 1 box is anything to be concerned about. The design is what's important.

Most of the time I use an Aesthetix Caplyso. My Wadia 861SE has a volume control, so I can run it direct to the amps, but overall I like having the preamp in the system. I don't like Pass preamps. Pass amps are great but the preamps have no life to them. You shouldn't take my word for it, though. I always recommend listening to any piece of audio equipment before buying it.

The ARC Ref 3, Ayre and Aesthetix preamps are all dead quiet. Its not a factor. I wouldn't worry about it.
zd542
5,339 posts
 
"How does running the Wadia directly into the amp compare to the Calypso? I have that option with the PS Audio DAC, but have not tried it. Before the PS Audio DAC, I had a Wyred4Sound DAC 2 with a digital volume control and preferred a preamp with that particular system. It sound fine as long as the volume was above 30 or so if I remember correctly. I'd have to figure out how to incorporate a phono stage though."

You just have to try it. Results can vary, its more of a personal preference. I get good sound either way but I like my system more with my preamp.

"Richard Vandersteen mentioned that if I bi-amp the 5As that it's important that the amp modules driving each speaker share the same power transformer or else the crossovers, amps, or speakers could be damaged. Can't remember exactly which it is, but his warning had put it out of my mind at the time."

Not so much damaged, but poor sound quality. That's why I do a vertical biamp. There's no need for you to worry with your Theta. You can only do a vertical biamp with it. Couldn't mess it up if you wanted to. I believe he goes over it in the owners manual.
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