2. music
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Music is sound, sound can be music

It was hard to make a title that fit what I wanted to talk about. Reading the thread about the deleted Hip-hop/Rap thread was an interesting window on some of the mindset here (some of which was unfortunate and depressing too but that's the world we live in....). What struck me was the attitude that if it's not played on a traditional instrument it's not music, or it just "sucks" in some way.

First, many instruments today, lots of brass ones especially or guitars didn't exist until the last 100-200 years. Do they not make music?

But you have to learn to use it skillfully, so I read. Knowing how to read and write music surely qualifies one yes? Talented even, if your can write complex pieces?

Ok, then. 25 years ago I worked with early digital audio systems using sequencers and MIDI. My partner graduated with honors from Berklee college of music and was a composer. He wrote some amazing work without touching anything more than a mouse and keyboard. Was it music?

10 years later I worked with another person who did incredible work in sound collage and electronic music. They did use a controller that is essentially a piano keyboard but it only sends note data to the system. She could play wonderfully on a real piano but often used non-linear editing and manipulation to produce innovative soundscapes. Was it music?

There are other examples where people do all sorts of experimental things with sound and not a single traditional instrument is ever used. Is it art?

My point here is if you don't like something that's fine. It doesn't make you a bad, stupid, or ignorant person. Neither are you those things if you don't understand why people create things or how they choose to do it. Of course, you are free to say what you like, that's your right. But don't be surprised when you are considered ignorant and intolerant when all you have to say is negative and derogatory remarks.

Life is too short to spend energy on things you don't like. Move on past and participate in the things you enjoy and let others enjoy theirs. Or maybe open you mind and give something more than a cursory glance if curiosity gets you, explore, read, listen and learn. You may decide it really isn't for you, but then again you might.
jet88

Showing 3 responses by jet88

jet88 OP
62 posts
 
Thanks everyone for all the replies. There's a lot of good thought and dialogue here.

@frogman  I think it is you that missed the point. I assert this by you closing statement:

 "So, let’s see, those who clamor for open mindedness and respect for all are themselves incapable of allowing others to hold a different personal opinion by which they define an art genre? Got it."

 I made it quite clear that others can have their own opinions. I also made it clear that how you express yourself is how you will be judged by others. Don't like it because you think it's not music for whatever reasons? Fine. You can even say why just as you did in a reasonable, respectful manner. It's the snide remarks and thinly veiled racism I have issues with that I saw. In those cases, people still have the right to speak but I don't have to listen to them. That doesn't make me incapable of allowing others to have a different opinion, it makes me incapable of listening to ignorance and hatred.

Lastly, I encouraged people to give different things a fair chance before deciding they don't like it. And if they did decide they don't, that it was perfectly ok.
jet88 OP
62 posts
 
I'm very happy about the discussion my thread has sparked. Even the difference of opinions is great. The level of discourse and ideas presented about what music is, or could be is fantastic

Give yourselves applause for showing that this community of audiophiles is full of intelligent, articulate people who can have discussions with maturity, respect, thoughtfulness, and a shared love of sound.

Keep the tent big, welcome the strange and unusual, the different and weird. Yes, there's things out there that are deeply problematic like misogyny, racism, glorifying violence, etc. Together we can try to understand, ask questions, discuss and analyze and sift the wheat from the chaff, and by doing so discover new things worthy of our time and attention. The rest will naturally fall away.

Thanks again, you have all heartened me in rather dark times.
jet88 OP
62 posts
 
Man, I feel like a broken record (pun not intended but...) going on about this but I'm loving the discussion! I wish I was not so busy and could participate beyond cheerleading, lol. At least I can read along in between working.
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