DO CABLES REALLY MATTER?


Yes they do.  I’m not here to advocate for any particular brand but I’ve heard a lot and they do matter. High Fidelity reveal cables, Kubala Sosna Elation and Clarity Cable Natural. I’m having a listening session where all of them is doing a great job. I’ve had cables that were cheaper in my system but a nicely priced cable that matches your system is a must.  I’m not here to argue what I’m not hearing because I have a pretty good ear.  I’m enjoying these three brands today and each is presenting the music differently but very nicely. Those who say cables don’t matter. Get your ears checked.  I have a system that’s worth about 30 to 35k retail.  Now all of these brands are above 1k and up but they really are performing! What are your thoughts. 
calvinj

Showing 8 responses by ganainm

Just one more " vote" for newbies trying to sort  it out, I know I won't change any minds for the vast majority. My background :  EE degree, serious acoustic musician, well versed on subtle tonal nuances, very knowledgable about testing, stats, and multiple forms of bias and outcome incentive.  Audiophile with much electronic hands on experience. Open to the fun of tinkering testing tweaking etc. Have tried many cables for fun.

No, cables if solid basic design and constructiion are highly unlikely to make an audible difference in any audio sysytem unless adding a filtering component.  Ears like taste buds are highly influenced by expectation. At least wine snobs will do double blind tests and have a good laugh at unexpected results. And of course variations in wine chemistry really DO affect taste and smell, well in accordance with well defined laws of physics biology and chemistry.  Audio cables of good basic design would necessitate violations of well established physics to make the differences discussed, which while not inconceivable, puts huge burden of proof i.e. hign degree of unbiased repeatability to be taken seriously. And THEN and only then a search for the exciting new laws of physics would begin.  Scence denial is not a serious problem in enjoying a hobby.  It IS a serious problem in many other aspects of life, health and ecology so it might be a shame if cable silliness is a gateway drug  to "science is fake".
Just my take for newbies and the "still questioning" few.
I do sometimes choose to exploit tne very real Placebo effect in on health with a few dollars of a supplement with a hint of scientific underpinning, if there is very low likelihood of harm. (Immunology, psychology, microbiome etc. hugely complex systems with MUCH unresolved science, unlike 0-mhz electronic signal transmission)  Obviously we all choose what amount to spend on audio placebo. But some of us will chose to challenge the science deniers in part because "I can say anything I want and shout you down to make a buck" isn't working out so well. 
OK off to practice mandolin. Anyone want to discuss if a $30 pick is "worth it"  vs. a .35  one?
  ;  )
Prof I just want to re-enforce your comments on the profit incentive in the bolstering of unsupportable claims. This IS why the FDA steps in in medical claims requiring challenging testing to be a "player". Much is still allowed especially in the non FDA aproved areas. You can bet if someone elses money (well, your money but aggregated) was paying for cables as in medical insurance, this would be a rather different conversation with different stakeholders..But I can certainly agree with those who say "it's MY money and this is friggin' audio!". 
But people should understand the financial incentive by the audio industry to get us to spend all kinds of money on dubious premises. Note I do not include visual and structural aesthetics, bling factors, long durability, company location  or business model etc etc etc as not perfectly valid contributors to buying choices.  But SELLING specifically on fraudulant claims deserves pushback. So this is mine, among many others, including the tireless prof. Thanks.
And yes djones51, welcome, all your thought are entirely resonable and many in this hobby agree but you will be amazed at the efforts and sometimes sadly, vitriol that may be directed at such "heresy". Keep your high water boots handy but enjoy your piece of the audio/music hobby.
Elizabeth I agree that many folks have valid reasons for enjoying the sound of expensive cables more than the cheap ones. Even bling and look, construction etc seems perfectly good reasons to spend more. My main problem is extraordinary claims made by sellers and then repeated by gullible believers for many reasons. If you like what you like and can aford it, have at  it.  If you thought about the variables and prefer to give less import to hard physics and engineering and more to your own complex senses and psycology thats fine. But  newcomers should know there really is a lot of pretend fake not- real made up physics and statistical math out there. There is a ton of fun in this hobby even involving "blurry edges" of science and perception (dacs anyone) circuit implementation, room acoustics, beautfully constructed electronics, the incredibly variability of speaker designs and builds, to have wildly divergent opinions and experiences in the audio hobby to share and not have to butt heads against the brilliant work theoretiical AND applied, that defines small signal propogation in wire transmission lines. 

Prof. Sadly I gotta tell you many docs  DID and sometimes still do put up just such objections as you mentioned although now studies and their interpretation are taught early and often to the profession. Ironically I am one who does sometimes object to the way Evidence Based Medicine is used when the systems (people and their pharmacophysiology) are so incredibly complex and variable and even really good studies are hard to reproduce. The "evidence" in Evidence Based Medicine is highly subject to the finances involved. And many docs still do cry out "how dare you" when you suggest, and show them good studies, that their practice is influenced by that industry sponsered golf trip. By contrast the measurements and mind set of the engineering world which I stay in touch with is generally pretty straight in part because the outcomes are much more closely tied to first principals. You know, the math works, the bridge stays up. Two pieces of copper are much more alike than 2 people.  Fortunately the medical profession is generally improving fast.
The good double blind study is now coupled with advanced molecular biology and genetic understanding to make the science stronger.
Good luck with your son's study!
Audio content:  good music especially live at the bedside definetely helps people relax and feel less pain. And probably helps them heal faster. Studies evolving.
dlcockrum
It is an audio forum.  But we audio nuts are a wordly sophisticated bunch so we know that to best understand the nuances of audio we have to have context in the greater universe of physics, philosophy and all of mankinds hopes and dreams. Or maybe its the post-op pain pills.
Roachie
Great poetry man!  For you cables DO matter and I share your passion for the music. I'm sure we would have fun celebrating Montiverdi and alot of the Dorian Catalog over a good port. We would just let cables slide...
Well gosh, if a group wants a discussion among folks who only want to discuss differences in cables they think they hear, with others of the same mind set, by all means do so and have fun. Just call it something other than "DO CABLES MAKE A DIFFERENCE...." which seems to invite dissenting opinions.
And the reason the burden of proof is not onthe sceptics is because of 150 years of Electrical Theory and Engineering not to mention the huge majority of actual unbiased blinded testing. If that stuff means nothing to you, well there really isn't a discussion to be had.
And if one CAN offer repeatable, verifiable evidence of the Highly Unlikely in signal transmission,  well, as I tell my friends who are fervent believers in ESP or ghosts, or UFO's or homeopathy, great, bring it on I would truly love to have a solid paradigm stood on it's head. I WANT to believe in magic, really I do.  
That seems to be the last of what I have to offer this thread, thanks for the many well intentioned thoughtful and funny posters of all mind sets. Shame about the other types.  Good night and joy be with you all.