ARC Ref 3: Tung-Sol 6550 in power supply?

Guido,

Keep trying different 6550's (probably a voltage regulator). PS tubes have a huge influence on the sound (as you have discovered). You should go after some NOS Tungsols. I would be very surprised if they didn't outperform the SED's in a big way. The very best TS's are the solid blackplate (no holes in the plates) triple D getters. They are very pricey but you only need one. If evryone took oneobgyn's approach to this hobby, nobody would learn anything on this forum.

Bart

I will be swapping my $1200 Ming DA 2A3 preamp with a friend who owns a Ref 3. I had my pre up to his house for a comparison with his Ref 3 last weekend and it was a tossup. Some things done better by one and some better by the other. The tubeset in the Ming DA cost more than the preamp. It would not be competeive without these tubes. The Ming DA had all the stock caps and resistors when the comparison was conducted (inexpensive components that do not do justice to the preamp but unavoidable at the asking price). We then installed two blackgate power supply and two Mundorf SIO output caps in the Ming DA. This tightened the bass dramatically (even without proper burn in of about 300 hours) and eliminated the area in which the Ref 3 outperformed the Ming DA. To my ears it is superior to the Ref 3 in all parameters at this stage. We intend to address the resistors, tube sockets and rails next. I will use his Ref 3 for about a month while he uses the Ming DA. I have invested over $20,000 in an NOS tube collection over the past four years (I am trying to acquire a lifetime supply of the very best NOS before they are gone). If you are convinced that the SED 6550C is the ideal tube in the Ref 3, great. I would be very interested in hearing what Elberoth thinks of the Tung Sol when he tries it. Assumptions are often incorrect in this hobby. Experimentation is what helps us progress.

Bart

Oneobgyn,

You have tried them all? Really? Which have you tried?
What amazes me is that people spend 10,000 on a preamp and then are offended that the best sounding tubes cost a lot of money. There are some good current production tubes but I do not know of one example where they are not bested by NOS. In most cases the disparity is huge. Elberoth, when you try that NOS Tung Sol, let us know how you liked it.

Bart

Elberoth,

The PS tubes have a dramatic imfluence on the sound. I agree with you about the 6H30, it is a shame it was used.
ARC has produced a well balanced sound with it though. I don't know if I am correct or not Oneobgyn. I do not own the ARC (as previously stated). I heard it at a friends house and compared it to my Ming DA (as previously stated).
We were going to swap pres for a month but he decided to sell his ARC and it sold as soon as he posted it. I guess
you haven't really rolled "them all" or you would have stated which ones you tried. If you think the sound you have with the stock tubes is as good as it can be, then don't try anything else. You should not discourage others from experimenting. It is the people that try things that advance the hobby. You should also bear in mind that because you in your system with yours ears think that rolling tubes in this pre is pointless, others with different systems and tastes may conclude otherwise.
By the way, what 20,000 hour tubes are you using? That is laughable.

Bart

Thanks to Elberoth and Ethannnn for validating what any experienced tube roller figuered out a long time ago. PS tubes have a huge influence on the sound and the best NOS beats the best current production in a big way. I guess Guido and obgyn are better talkers than listeners. I stated and restated on this thread my limited experience with this preamp. The friend that sold his did bring it by for one day and I did hear it in my system. It is not a good value in my estimation as my $1200 Ming DA beat it in most parameters. From its sonic signature I am fairly certain that the NOS Tung Sols would be a huge improvemnt.
I can't speak to the GEC (never heard it). Ethannnn you should take Elberoth up on his offer to audition the TS.
If you are falling short in the bass with the GEC, the TS should remedy this without any loss of midrange magic. I don't have time to argue with obgyn or guido any longer and it is obviouis to me I will not learn much from them (that is the reason I visit these forums). Don't take my lack of response to your inane attacks as evidence of anything other than I don't have time to waste on it.

Bart