Well, I'm thinking Mercedes.. What do you guys think of this ? Thinking, if I am going through the trouble to do this, why not take it to the next level?
https://www.mundorf.com/audio/en/shop/Cables/MConnect_SGW/
Knowing Mundorf is amazing and silver makes a great sonic difference. What I’m not so sure of is, would a short run inside of an amp make a large enough difference? Certainly does on an interconnect, and I’d have it to Canare OFC speaker wire externally..
Thing is, you think 1.5mm (14-15awg) is enough for 250wpc? Probably way more than enough I’d think..
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Well, delusional idiocy might be taking the description of an upgrade experiment a bit far, it can be delusional idiocy which finds new things, and most here I think enjoy this experimentation, I do - change the sound profile, experiment..
In my case, Bryston the company is about great audio - but not completely, they are a business whose mission is to move boxes, I can very well see why they wouldn't install €100 German cable - and not even for all runs in the amp. What they used was a business decision. I ordered the cable, let's go, let's see.
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How do we know ^those two things^ are true?
'We', not sure. I do from personal experience with interconnects and other Mundorf products. Their MCap Solder is divine :) My use case though would be from the board to the speaker binding posts, maybe I should consider their multiple conductor type twisted, make overall larger gauge and have the twisted separation - dunno..
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100%, I had a conversation with a chap who compared options with a parametric EQ, I could see his point.
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Almost overwhelmed and very grateful for all of the lively and informative opinions here, and it’s much appreciated gentlemen, thank you.
I referenced an old Bryston, mine is a 4B ST. I really appreciate the gents with experience with this particular Mundorf cable I’m considering, and also those who haven’t upgraded any internal wire. I view it as a reduction in weak links. Weak links are inevitable, one less of them, it’s like one more high end interconnect in the mix. Each binding post, each banana plug takes something, goal here is to up the score by 1.
The wire in my view is horrendous at 100 Euro for 1M, laughable, but I’d only need 1M of it.
The holes on the board are nice, the boards are nice, they are eyelets which fit a 14awg max, so would fit that 15.5awg/1.5mm elegantly - on that amp, they then connect via faston to the binding posts - I found some ’better’ furutech ones.
All has been encouraging to move forward with this project, interesting to think about the bass and clarity I’d get with 14 awg silver solid core, Mundorf.
Love reading your great stories and experiences!
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No, and I’d probably agree with them on that, I’ve used both their cable and others with no detectable change. In fact no power changes I’ve heard have made much impact on any of my equipment, at least not yet.
It’s all about signal. Bryston used 1015 type AWM as internal amp wire on everything - internal power, but also board to speaker post - Here is an example - Lots to improve upon here I think:
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Well, we are not talking binary function, a coat hanger might make it functional too, and I would never state I know more than an engineer, but I can say with a high degree of confidence a sterling conductor in the chain, no matter the variables changes the sound - usually for the better in my experience, and when we might compare this to pieces of copper Appliance Wire (AWM) used in the stock amp, not too far off from Home Depot material, I would bet fairly heavily Mundorf will be a change for the better.
Rhetorical question but why would one install a high end exhaust system in their vintage car to gain a few horse power and enjoy the job, knowing that Ford or Toyota wouldn’t install that level of exhaust quality out of the factory - engineers know there is better, but there is a business decision.
I enjoy doing it, and if the question is, is it all worth it for an estimated 10-15% change or improvement, I’d say yes maybe contrary to many, in my case and opinion, sure.. It’s my mustang.
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Copper with a dielectric of whatever non-conductive material, don't care - PCB is not in scope, we can't make the board with Mundorf traces, at least not yet. You might want to try experimenting yourself, it's astounding what changes like this can bring, whether it's in your encyclopedia set or not.
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Well gentlemen, job complete.
What can I say, but wow. It sounds beautiful, it sounds like silver - and a good implementation of silver - crisp airy highs, spatial, separation, and a thick low frequency bass - just exactly the kind of accurate sound I was looking for. I would absolutely recommend the overpriced Mundorf SilverGold wire..
Some photos of the job:
The 4B-ST has some quirks, but generally easy to work on, I'm listening while typing, just finished screwing down the top.
To those who say cable doesn't have an impact, it is just incorrect - plain and simple, this job/mod/upgrade was a NET WIN!
Thumbs up, I've really appreciated everyone's great inputs to my thread and my project! It was a WIN.
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I’ve had a few hours with it - occasionally I get a jazz track - what I listen to mostly - come on, and I experience an elevated level of clarity, bass and stage depth. And for those who experiment with cables might know what I am referring to by that 10-15% bump in improvement, I think that’s what I achieved here..
The old wires, I should have posted a picture of the conductor, I’ve ripped the same cable out of old kenwoods, it’s a stranded twisted and tinned conductor with a nerve core in the center - I know this wire, I’ve replaced it elsewhere too, only with OCC to get a similar improvement.
Interesting side part of the story, I noticed a main filter cap leg not soldered on the main board - totally missed by the assembly! I’ve seen a lot, that was a first for me. The leg was snipped, but no solder.
The furutech connectors worked out, but if you see from my pics, it was tight. I also realized that if I continue to do this kind of thing, getting a quality desoldering solution would be so very helpful, pumps just lack.
I also wouldn’t have minded some of that deoxit gold brush on stuff for the modules - both gold plated fingers, and board pads - maybe even the faston tabs too on the binding posts.
We were kidding speaking about coat hangers, funny enough the feel of the Mundorf wire was like a silver PTFE coated coat hanger, it was easy and nice to bend into shape, the 15.5AWG/1.5mm fit perfectly into the eyelets, and finished with Mundorf Supreme solder.
A part of me wanted to do the caps too, but I’m sure they have a few more years on them..
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That is a great suggestion, thanks mate. I was looking at the photos more too, and wondering if I should look into replacing the power lead too - not sure of any audible impact though. Thanks for having a look!
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Something like that may well have blown your comments out of the water!
Man, I couldn’t believe my eyes when I saw it. Like double take, think, look again, then realize. It had to have been making contact, the leg was tightly up against the through hole/pad - but wow. I took a photo of that too, I should have posted. If I remember correctly, since I was mainly looking at the underside of the board, it was a negative lead - the positive was soldered properly.
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2 days, 3 evenings of this Mundorf cable in my amp - Every 4B-ST should have this, I'm so glad I did it.. I think I'm going to order another 1M, chop it up into 20cm increments for speaker jumpers. 4B-ST even today isn't a cheap amp, but I now have a high-end sound which far exceeds a 4B-ST.
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That’s awesome.. Hard to describe the silver sound other than HiFi in every true sense of the term.
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