New Linear Parasound Halo JC1+ monoblocks, an even more improved new John Curl design
The good old linear Halo JC1’s monoblocks were released 2003 and were one of the best and could drive anything without a sweat, even the Wilson Alexia with 0.9ohm loading. These new linear JC1+ monoblocks have some very good improvements, and even better drive ability than the old. At $17k not exactly cheap, but probably better than any others amp around that pricing. Enjoy. https://www.stereophile.com/content/parasound-halo-jc-1-monoblock-power-amplifier-0
Some serious current ability, peak output current is specified as 180amps!!!, to drive down to 2ohms without a sweat, as the distortion figures don’t change from 8 to 4 to 2ohms.
The JC 1+ is specified as being able to deliver 450W into 8 ohms (26.5dBW), 850W into 4 ohms (26.3dBW), 1300W into 2 ohms (25.1dBW), all at 0.15% distortion.
What about these. Apparently Underwood HiFi has a few monoblocks FS
Ampzilla 2000 is a 300 watt mono amp that is stable into 1 ohm loads. Reviews have been superb In the The Absolute Sound product of the year review they said: "The combo (of amps and preamp) is far from inexpensive though that figure does include two excellent phono preamps and a headphone amplifier. Reflect too, that there are competing electronics exceeding $100,000 that give you far less of everything." The entire circuit is fully balanced from input to output and includes a unique new unbalanced-to-balanced converter for single-ended inputs.
8Ω: Minimum 300 watts, 20Hz-20kHz
4Ω: Minimum 540 watts, 20Hz-20kHz
THD and IM Distortion: 4-16Ω less than .05% @ any power level up to rated at any frequency or combination of frequencies between 20Hz-20kHz List price $10,200.00 Sale $5,100.00/Pr in blue Ambrosia preamp
I have a pair of the Zillas (from Walter) in house right now. Very good amps. Apparently Bongiorno was better than Curl back in the day on amps, the reverse for preamps. They are arc welders.
That said, I am curious on the JC1+ as in JA's latest Classe review he said the + is the more tube like amplifier. I don't think the original JC1 was known to be particularly tube like. Problem is $17k for amps built in Taiwan is a struggle for me when the originals were half that.
Not knowing this amp because of lack test measurements, the best thing I think Bongiorno did was the old Sumo Nine and later Nine-Plus ss circlotron type Class-A amps.(needed the input opamp changed to something better, also the output transistors all 20 of them if you wanted to go all out) https://6moons.com/audioreviews/thorens/sumo.gif
No independent testing done on The Ampzilla 2000, yes the manufacturer gives the 8ohm-300w and 4ohm-540w, but no 2ohm figures. I've said this before a few times now, it's fine to say an amp is "stable" into 2ohms, it does not mean it can "drive" it, just means it won't oscillate and blow up. But so is a little 1980's Nad 3020 30w integrated stable into 2ohms, but that doesn't mean it can "drive" 2ohms.
This is what counts, for "driving" 2ohms. (almost doubling wattage) Independent test on 8 4 and 2ohms from the original Parasound Halo JC1 Stereophile.
all at 0.15%
450W into 8 ohms 850W into 4 ohms 1300W into 2 ohms
Halo JC1 is a current powerhouse 1khz dynamic tone bursts, it can do 586.5W - 8ohm 1154W - 4 ohms 2255W - 2 ohms!!
and no less than 4200W into 1 ohm!!!!!!!!!!!
This is what you call able to "drive" 2ohms and be stable!
I've owned the JC1+ monos for a few months driving my Wilson Sasha 1 loudspeakers. They pair very nicely with my ARC Ref 6 preamp. They replaced my Levinson 33H monos. Very dynamic and extremely quiet. Seemingly unlimited power reserves. They also do not generate as much heat as the Levinsons and are about half the weight to boot! Very happy with the move.
The ML 33H’s were a good wattage doubler, and should drive even the Wilson Alexia’s 0.9ohm without stress being able to do: 300w-8ohms 500w-40hms 900w-2ohms I think it would have more come down to the character sound of the amp you liked. Do you listen to the Halo JC1’s in "high bias mode"??? As they definitely sound their best to me in that, as in low bias to me they sound a touch dry, but then you feed them with a tube pre.
All the big early ML’s I’ve heard and worked on, have a dark’ish sound and a little soft in put you through the wall dynamics. Save for one, the mighty ML2 monoblocks, but they are only 25w Class-A total. But 50w-4ohms 100w-2ohms 400w-1ohm still able to drive the Alexia’s to a certain volume effortlessly.
George, I use the amps in high bias mode but the lower gain setting that seems to match my preamp better. I've upgraded the stock power cords with Shunyata Alpha NR cables to nice effect. All the best!
I rather buy Accuphase if I were looking to spend close to $20,000 on power amp seperates. I'm sure the Parasound have more grunt but let's be honest even Alexia 2 that seem to be your often touted punish load speaker don't need anything near 180amperes of power, even for peaks.
And when you're spending this much money looks are important too. I do not like or appreciate the understated brushed metal chassis that Parasound is known for. Nor do I feel comfortable paying for anything assembled in the far east for these prices.
even Alexia 2 that seem to be your often touted punish load speaker don’t need anything near 180amperes of power, even for peaks.
0.9ohms epdr is almost a dead short, there is no "don’t need anything like" that’s why they sound sooo good into the Alexia’s compared to limp d**k class-d, mosfet or tubes into them. Yes better was the Gryphon Antillion with even more current, by a small margin, but way too expensive. We’ve done the a/b on the Alexia’s
I do not like or appreciate the understated brushed metal chassis that Parasound is known for.
Every "glitz queen" has his own idea of what’s beautiful, I like the industrial way they look without handles, but that’s not the reason for their sound.
Nor do I feel comfortable paying for anything assembled in the far east for these prices.
Each to his own, my new Volvo T5 is also, and a joy to drive and goes and handles like it’s on rails. And if the JC1+'s were built in the US they'd be double the $$
The class D Hypex NC1200 amp module does 1200 watts into 2 ohms (hence the name).......more than the mentioned Levinson above. Limp d**k class A/B amp! he he Very, very few speakers have a load below 2 ohms (including most of the lastest Wilson and Magico speakers).....maybe 5% or less. Obsessing about one factor above all is not smart. There are tons of factors that effect sound.
Check out these NC1200 mono block amps from Apollon (also available as dual mono stereo amp). Weiss input buffer with separate linear power transformer and Sparko regulators....solid silver WBT posts, super wire....super sound.....looks good too! $6000 for mono blocks (33lbs each) delivered to the US ($5500 for dual mono stereo).....Parasounds are $17K and 83lbs. Will be fun when someone A/Bs these amps with the Parasounds.
What is really interesting is that I can look at these Apollon amps and see a bunch of things I can do that would improve the sound.....and not by a little.
Hypex NC1200 amp module does 1200 watts into 2 ohms
Please please! show "independent" testing of the rms wattage’s for 8ohm, 4ohm, and 2ohm loading, that will show, instead of this smoke screen you’ve thrown up.
No smoke screen....just the published numbers. I mean, who cares if it only does 1100 watts into 2 ohms at 1% distortion? Still plenty of power for 95% plus of the high end speakers. The only thing that matters is how it sounds and will it drive a particular speaker to the levels you want.
Your audio phase shift measurement for the IceEdge module means nothing (already pointed out time and time again) and it is not even for this particular amp module. You are confused. This is the Hypex NC 1200 module....not the IceEdge 1200AS1/2 module that I am referring to. What you quoted above was for the IceEdge module.
Please people, listen for yourself!.....do not trust anyone’s opinion about anything....including mine.
By the way, I measured 1000 watts into 2 ohms with the mono IceEdge 1200AS1 module (The mono modules are the ones I used in my amps). The stereo module (1200AS2) puts out less power into low impedances as there is just one power supply for both channels.
BTW, You can buy mono block amps using these same NC1200 modules, same Hypex 1200 watt supply and Weiss op amps from VTV for $3000 the pair ($2600 with best Sparko Labs input op amp). Not as good of output wiring and output connections, nor chassis nor linear power supply for op amps. Still, a wonderful value. These modules are the same as what Mola Mola uses in their $17K mono blocks. The Mola Mola uses Bruno Putzeys discrete input stage while the VTV and Apollon use the Weiss discrete input stage.
If you want the stock op amp buffer built into the NC1200.....then a pair is $1800.....Dang! Even with the stock op amp it sounds really good. The Atsah amps sold 6 years ago for $9K using the stock input buffer.
Doesn’t matter what is said here above about Class-D by some that have vested interests in them. There is no way in the world it can compete against these Parasound Halo JC1 or the JC1+ when driving speakers such as the Wilson Alexia many of the higher end B&W’s, fact! Cheers George
If you have speakers like that then it makes sense that you MIGHT have to spend tons of money on big monster amps. There are incredible sounding speakers that don't need 83 lb. back breakers and bank breakers to power them. Most of us audiophiles (95%) don't have speakers that require that kind of current or super low impedance drive.....super fact! If you own speakers that need tons of current and are super super hard to drive then you limit yourself to buying some seriously expensive heavy amps to power them. Think before you buy your next pair of speakers. If you can get a pair of speakers just as transparent for the same money (or less) and they are much easier to drive....then you have way more choices of amps and you don't need to spend as much money.....fact.
Check out Spatial X3 speakers.....powered 15 inch woofer and 97db sensitive, 8 ohm and you are only driving 100hz on up. Very transparent!
Check out Tekton Moab, Encore and Ulfberht......high 90s sensitivity and 4 ohms. Super transparent!....14 tweeters in parallel acting as midranges down to 400hz.
Check out GR Research....many open baffle kits using planar, cones, open baffle servo woofers..incredible sound.....way easy to drive.
Check out Li Speakers.....Chinese full range drivers that are 90 plus db to drive, super inexpensive and very transparent.
I am sure the Parasound amps are very very nice. But, do you need them? Do you really need 180 amps peak! Are you going on tour with the Who? Are you filling a stadium with sound? Are your speakers really that demanding? Do you play that loud? Remember, a speaker rated at 90db needs one watt at one meter....maybe 5 at your listening position.....so 100db at your seat requires 50 watts....and 110db requires 500 watts (all assuming nothing less than 3 ohms). How loud do you listen? However, if your speaker is 2 ohm or less then you need way more power for any given level. Super low impedance speakers just don't make sense (unless you already own them and cannot let them go) FACT!
The NC1200 has tons of power and there are very very few speakers that they could not play super loud. If you have never heard this module drive low impedance speakers than you know nothing of their capability (1200 watts at 2 ohms is plenty!). This is not an "I think" game. This is an "I know" game. The only way you know anything in audio is to listen. Words are just words. Truth is discerned by the ear.
If you have speakers like that then it makes sense that you MIGHT have to spend tons of money on big monster amps.
Glad you’ve seen the light. No one should make out class-d’s can drive 3ohm and below, with -phase angle like the Alexia’s, B&W’s etc Like they can be driven by Parasound’s, Gryphon’s etc. And like many other linear amps known for current ability can. And there are many speakers just like that.
Who cares about a few speakers that are hard to drive? Only their owners and you. You keep saying it is so important....but to whom? If 95% of speakers (including low impedance ones) can be driven by the NC1200 then who are you talking to? I said MIGHT on purpose, because many of those so called hard to drive speakers....I am betting, would work fine with an NC1200. Never heard anyone say otherwise.....but you never know till you LISTEN.....which neither one of us have. So we know nothing......just guessing......but I would not bet against 1200 watts into 2 ohms (the amps rating). Why are you so obsessed about the few extremely hard to drive speakers? Are they the only good speakers on the planet? Maybe you should get out more.
If I were one of those looking for an amp in the Parasound price range and below (even if I was one of the 95% that does not ever need the current it gives).....then I would evaluate it to see if it sounds great on my speakers....even if my speakers were 95db and 8 ohm. The sound of an amp is what I am interested in......how transparent is it? Does it give me goosebumps.....does it sound real and wow...ish. If I were one of those few that had a super hard to drive speaker and I could afford the Parasound then it would be an obvious amp to try and I also would try the $6K Apollon all out NC1200 because it competes with $20K Krell mono blocks and there is nothing wrong with paying less.....more other toys to buy......or give it to charity.
Only by trying something in your home can you know something. It is not what someone "thinks" and "states" on a forum that is real. It is only what you experience that is real. Please, trust yourself.
Question for JC1+ owners: how good are the stock power cords that come with the units? I currently use AQ Hurricane but am contemplating ordering the stock power cords and moving the Hurricane PCs to the DAC and streamer.
I owned the Pass Labs X260.8 - I called to ask Pass Labs and they recommended using the stock power cords (as they were voiced using them during design) instead of the AQ Hurricane.
Parasound does not take calls from customers anymore, hence the query.
Ric is spot on (as usual). A long long time ago I had Harry Pearsons personal pair of Genesis Vs. I tried a lot of amps, but the one that grabbed them by throat and made sing was Kinergetics KBA 75- class A amp, but man the electric meter spun and even in the winter it kept my house warm. Of course that was long before class D was around, let alone top flight designs. Sadly, I blew it up while swapping out power cords, so the Gen Vs went down the road. Many many speakers later, I got a pair of Emerald Physics 3.4s which are very efficient/amp friendly, and amazing. Alas, they are no longer made as they do everything very well, however hey do come up on the used market from time to time, or the 2. series which has the same 12", but augmented with either one or two 15" woofers
For around 3 years now (or is it 4?) I have owned Rics EVS 1200, dual mono (don’t know how it compares to the Hypex 1200. After a couple months with the EVS, I got a LSA 350 GaN Voyager, which I preferred as to my ears it sounded more continuous, at least until I replaced all my WW series 8 cables. Sadly, I managed to take out a GaN module and was glad I kept the EVS1200, which sounds considerably better after I replaced the WW cabling with Ali-E mostly Odin Gold cables, which I replaced one at a time (each upgrade easily improved the sound) with the speaker cables being the last, and boy, it tied everything together. Talk about saving money!
Im certainly not unhappy with the EVS 1200 (which I raved about prior to getting the Voyager), but I haven’t heard my recabled system with the Voyager to hear what, if any difference the recabling makes for it as well. wows of living on SS
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