Thoughts on the Linn LP12 turntable

@daveyf  All they have done is make a burlap sack out of a silk purse. It has become a caricature, a joke. You can never turn a bad execution into a good one. It is a waste of money trying.

The LP 12 is a relic of the past. There was a time when it was the best sounding table at a reasonable price. It was always a PITA. I owned two of them but it was always a love hate relationship. I got my first Sota in 1981 and never looked back. There are so many suspended tables that do it right now the Linn is not even worth a look. Used ones are popular on the market. People buy them and get going with the endless Linn upgrade program and think that turns them into something special. You can not turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. It is an antiquated design any way you look at it and it needs to get thrown out with the bath water. 

@markcooperstein , I owned two of them back in the late 70's. Back then they were the best turntable you could get at a reasonable price. Compared to many turntables made today they are archaic and a PITA. There are many sources of resonance in the chassis and tonearm board. The overall construction in second class. The Sota Sapphire is miles ahead of it as are SME tables, Basis tables and Avid tables. The Thorens 1600 is a better table for the money.

@daveyf , I have taken apart LP 12s down to the last screw. I have made custom bases for them. Relative to other turntables out there it is built like a Chinese music box. I would even take any VPI turntable over it. Do yourself a favor and ditch it. Get a VPI Scout just don't take the tonearm. There is no amount of silly upgrading that is going to make the LP12 even a class C turntable. I'm am really sorry if I hurt your feelings but you are not going to make me back away from the truth. If the LP 12 was the last turntable on earth I would stick to digital. If you can't afford a better turntable you should do the same.

@daveyf , all you have left are insults? Common davey boy, how about that cheap stamped sheet metal sub chassis sitting atop three springs tuned to the wrong frequency and the crappy Masonite arm board flapping around in the breeze, the two piece platter that rings like a bell. The tiny little dink of a motor that I can stall with a Q tip. Then there is that pathetic sort of wood base stapled together at the corners. Walmart wouldn't sell a turntable like that. If you think that is representative of a high end turntable in this day and age you are in the wrong forum. You might look into basket weaving. And for your information I built a cherry base for one thirteen years ago.

You can insult me all you want but that will not change the fact that the LP 12 is archaic and interesting only from a historic perspective. It's days have long passed. It was all but done in 1980 with the release of the original SOTA Sapphire. Over the next decade a pile of them were dumped into the used market where they could be picked up for pennies on the dollar by people like you who want to turn them into some kind of panacea. They are just an old turntable that the vast majority of serious audiophiles wouldn't go near. 

No amount of wishful thinking or modification is going to make the LP 12 representative of what a modern intermediate priced turntable can do. The Avid Acutus, SME, Sota and Basis turntables all are definitive improvements over the LP 12. The LP 12's day were done with the release of the original Sota Sapphire, never to return. This is not to say with careful use and setup a used LP 12 can not be made to perform at a reasonable level but to buy one new you have to be out of your mind. This is not IMHO, just a fact of life.

@slaw, If that is impressive you have a lot of listening to do.

@no_regrets , you have to be kidding me. I have used them all and the LP 12 is an antique. Its days ended in 1980. As a used turntable it is decent if the price is right. You might as well go out and buy an AR XA. That turntable is way more important from a historical perspective as it invented the genre. The LP 12 is nothing but a higher quality AR XA. It invented nothing. 

@slaw , good move. It was thoughtless and unnecessarily mean.  

@photomax, Sota, the first reasonably priced turntable that definitively out performed the LP 12 is still very much alive and making turntables that are better than the LP 12 and way more advanced in every way. History is littered mostly with Japanese low end turntables of no significance, changers and old idler wheel designs that also continue to be propped up in the used market like the LP 12. 

The reason I am so harsh on the LP 12 is that there are many turntables on the market that are much easier to deal with and in the end out perform it. This is coming from a guy who only will buy suspended and isolated turntables, who will only use turntables with hinged dust covers and who has owned two of them in the past. It's suspension design is inherently unstable and if it is not on a supremely stable surface it will skip easily. Footfall issues are legion with this turntable. A little bump will cause a skip. It's chassis and plinth are designed to resonate.

I do not have any financial skin in this game. My only motive is to prevent people from making the mistake of buying an LP 12. Sota, SME, Basis, Avid and Dohmann make for superior turntables. I own a Sota Cosmos Vacuum. I would love to own a Dohmann but it is a little too pricey for my wallet. The Basis Inspiration is another favorite. The good old Sota Sapphire is in the same price range as the LP12 and there is no comparison. 

@ghdprentice , While it is true that Sota had some production difficulties due to Covid and their revised Condor controller has a programing issue the Sota Sapphire still is significantly better than the LP12. If you go to the Nova with Vacuum you get a seriously better turntable. The Cosmos Vacuum is a turntable that is, from a performance perspective as good a any of the above turntables except the Dohmann (once it has a vacuum platter. Externally, it is a more rustic design which is easier and less expensive to make keeping the price down. I personally do not understand why people buy a turntable to look at. Inside that rustic interior is a very sophisticated design. I'm afraid you bought 50 year old mythology. If you get a Sota the LP12 will wind up on the used market in a week. I suggest either a Reed, Schroder, Kuzma or SME arm.😉

@ajhsu2 , No turning a sows ear into a silk purse. The current LP12 is just as antiquated as the one from decades ago. It does not even rate a class B in Stereophile terms. It's mystique was created in the mid 70s when (defective as it was) it was the best sounding turntable you could buy for reasonable money. I bought LP12 # 1 IN 1977 and held on to it for a year when frustrated with it's incompetent suspension I sold it for a Micro Seiki only to discover that I prefered the sound of the Linn so, in 1979 I bought LP12 # 2 and suffered with it for two years when I sold it for a SOTA Sapphire, a breath of fresh air to say the least. Not only did it sound better than the Linn but it was a delight to use and unlike the Linn nothing bothered it. Today there are several tables that surpass the LP12 in performance and are a better value, the Thorens TD 1600 to mention one. 

You guys can not get it though your heads that the LP 12 in it's current form is a BAD design. Forget about how it is made or the quality of the parts it is a bad design and just a glorified copy of the AR XA which was groundbreaking in the 60s.

@lewm , yes, the suspension morphology is the same as the Old Sapphire because unlike the LP12 it is the right design for a spring suspension. Both Avid, Basis and SME use basically similar  setups. The look is also generic SOTA. Other than that it is a totally different turntable than the old Sapphire. Nothing else is remotely similar. You could say the same for the LP12, but it's problem is that it is based on a bad design and nothing anyone else can say is going to change that. The LP12 is an overpriced Toyota Corolla. The Thorens TD 1600 is every bit as good if not better and much less expensive. Frankly, nothing Linn makes is of interest to me. If they went out of business tomorrow I would not even notice. 

@daveyf, do yourself a big favor and get yourself a decent turntable and you will never look back.