Perrew said:
"I tried different amps with VTL, no change. Used Transporter direct to Spectron, that lowered the noised a lot. Still Id want just two boxes, one amp and one source=>1 IC, 2PCs and SC i.e. minimum cables."
Yes, there's a lot to be said for a two-box system, particularly with Class D. With my Rowland Continuum 500, the incredibly sturdy chassis, short point to point wiring, physical isolation of components and, most importantly perhaps, Power Factor Correction (presenting an even load to the main and converting AC to 380V DC) leads to an ultra-quiet system.
Class does introduce EMI/RFI into your environment. If you've got a digital source, like a CDP, that introduces more and your general envirnonment may or may not be loaded with RFI. These factors make balanced mode, chassis design and circuit design critical to quiet operation. An integrated designed with all these factors in consideration gives you an elegant and, in the case of the C-500, a powerful, musical solution.
Dave |
Rowland has Magico's big, little (they're large for minis) mini-monitors that he uses with some custom sub. He recently sold his prototype big Magicos that he tri-amped. Anyway, the little bit that I heard was...magic.
Rowland-Magico, that's a match made in...Rowland's shop, if not heaven.
Dave |
Mapman said:
"I'm still thinking though that the Rowland 500w/ch Class D is probably the best high end match for my big power sucking Ohms."
This could be very true.
The pre section is "all new" and really brings a transparent sweetness and evenness that very few separate pres can match and then you have the well controlled power section, operating in DC (the pre does to) to give you ultra quiet background, all provided with very generous power reserves and high damping capacity. Even my traditional dynamic speakers appreciate the power, but the Ohms may well DEMAND it.
Dave |
Mapman, my friend, there's no getting around it, at $8800 ($9200 with phono)for the Continuum 500, you're talking "real money", BUT I think it's an incredible value or bargain. I've never had a moment of buyer's remorse. As you note, the pre-amp section competes with separate pres that cost more the C-500 in total. It's really a no-compromise integrated.
NAD is a great "value" for those that can't afford or don't want to afford 9k (I fully understand this position and I've been there myself in the past), but no one's going to say that it'll compete with an ARC Ref.3 pre-amp, as is actually said of Rowland's pre. Forget about the power side, where Rowland is literally in a class almost by itself.
If you need more power than 1000 watts into 4 ohms, then you'll have to consider separates, like a Capri driving two Spectron III monoblocks. I have little doubt that would be wonderful, but expensive and much bulkier than the C-500. Hey, but if you need the power, you need the power. (I suspect - hope - that the 1000 watts will be enough).
Dave |
Mapman asked:
"Do you know if Rowland has a satisfaction guaranteed policy of any kind? Its probably determined more by the dealer, I would guess."
Actually it's a Rowland thing and personal. He's outlasted many of his dealers and doesn't want unhappy customers. Mark at Soundings has told me of Jeff doing repair on amps that were well over ten-years old and even throwing in free upgrades as part of the deal. That's not an "official" position, but represents how Jeff personally feels about these things. He truly does all the warranty work himself.
If you've got a nearby dealer, then use them. If not, call Soundings, they'll cover the gaps in US distribution and they're the top Rowland dealer in the US, but they don't aim to step on other dealers. Tell them Dave sent you. Who knows, I may get five-bucks off a cable or something. (I have no "arrangement" with Rowland or Soundings, in case anyone wonders. I paid full retail for my Continuum 500, without any hesitation).
Now that I re-read you post, you might have been talking about listening on approval or a 30-day, money-back guarantee. That's a dealer thing for sure and I don't know a dealer that provides that. If you've got a dealer nearby, then I'd expect that you could use the demo unit over a weekend maybe. (At Soundings, they had a C-500 on the floor, in a system that I knew. Hence, I was very comfortable when I plunked down my money).
Dave |
Compare the Rowland Continuum 500 to "the best" separates. It'll stand that test. Final selection will be a matter of taste and priority, but the Rowland will be a contender.
Dave |
Wait 'til October Bill. After RMAF there'll be a bunch more jumping on board. ;-)
Dave |
Great idea Bill, would you host it on your site? ;-)
If you have a specific problem with my opinions, why don't you address them with a specific complaint rather than these weak little jabs. You gotta knock my head back to get my attention. Right now I have no idea as to why you have a specific annoyance with me.
BTW, plenty of people have taken my advice and thanked me. I'm only offering opinions and suggestions. Of course, I haven't owned 100+ TTs like you, but I have been a musician and audiophile longer than you. Some people think that my perspective is useful to them, so that's why I offer it, always with the suggestion that they followup by listening for themselves.
Dave |
Oh, I thought that we were talking via email. As I said in response to your email, I'm at 50-years, how 'bout you?
Dave |
Keep in mind that Kiwi's review was with the MBLs. I think that the Continuum is best matched with dynamic speakers (like Vienna Acoustic, Sonus Fabre, Wilson, Dali, etc.) that can use the power and control of this type amp.
I don't know enough about the MBLs to say what amps make them work and what doesn't, but I've heard them sound very different in different setups.
In my system, the Continuum 500 is very musical and emotionally involving when driven by either my Playback Designs MPS-5 or my TT. Rhythm and pace are astounding. This makes me suspect that the MBL is a bad match for the Continuum. With more "normal" speakers you're not going to have issues of emotion, musicality, rhythm or pace.
Dave |
Perrew, I'm worried that if you tried Spectron with MBLs and didn't find it involving then the Rowland will be only a little better. For most dynamic speakers I'd recommend the Continuum 500, but with MBLs I'm not so sure. I've never heard that combination, but Kiwi and now you report something missing with a couple of amps that I consider more alike than different.
With the Guarneri Memento and Magicos (Rowland uses Magico in his own set up) I'd expect a very happy result. I don't know the SP Tech at all.
If you can afford the cost and are willing to wait just a little, the new Vienna Acoustic The Music speakers have incredibly stunning midrange. Their proprietary 5" midrange driver covers frequencies from 100Hz to 20kHz with no crossover in that critical range. The absence of intermodulation distortion is stunning and the mids are stunning. In 2009 the line will include more choices, using that driver.
So, I'm thinking that the MBLs need something in addition to power to sound their best. As you no doubt know, they're very room critical, way more so than any other speaker that you've mentioned.
Dave |
I don't recall details of his sub. It looked prototype-ish, so it's likely to be something custom. Given his fondness of Magico, that would be a good suspect, but nothing more than conjecture.
Dave |
