Technics SL1200: standard overhang gauge or MintLP

I'll come out and say it:

I hate the Turntable Basics protractor.

I wouldn't say the Turntable Basics protractor is *inaccurate*, but it is not very *precise*. Set up your geometry using the Turntable Basics protractor, and everything will appear aligned properly. Then check it with a more precise protractor - it *may* appear way off. Realign with that more precise protractor, then double-check with the Turntable Basics protractor. It will still appear properly aligned.

I would love to have someone with a MintLP protractor compare their results with an arc protractor that I've created using MS Visio and the John Elison "Enjoy the Music" Excel spreadsheet that calculates Baerwald & Lofgren geometries. It takes about 10 minutes to generate a new protractor with a different Effective Length. The one I have generated is for a Rega / Origin Live tonearm (240 mm Effective Length). It would be even better if someone could show me how to generate a MS Visio file automatically from calculated values in an Excel spreadsheet. :)

To take this free protractor to the next level, print this protractor on an transparent plastic sheet and place it on top of a mirror. This may be my low-cost activity this weekend.

Anyone care to try it? Just PM me. I'm interested in knowing how much I'm "leaving on the table" (pun intended) by not dropping $110.00 on another protractor).

Hello Nrenter,

I've had a few Protractors over the years, first the Mo-Fi Geodisc about 10 years ago.

Then Doug Deacon suggested the Turntable Basics Protractor to me, and I thought it was better than the Geodisc, being a Mirror, having two Null Grids. Doug explained-taught me how to enhance its aiming acuracy, with the use of a a piece of thread, to extend the Sight Line to Tonearm Pivot. I felt the sound did indeed improve.

I think maybe the T-Basics Tractor's one flaw is thicker Grid Lines, and one doesn't really realize-know this until something better comes along.

Print-ups from Vinyl engine just didn't seem worth the effort, they were in no way better than the Geodisc, or TB Tractor for Baerwald Alignment IMO.

Then for a period, Ken Willis, and I had collaborated, and Ken kindly emailed some PDF files of some Arc Tractors for my particular S-P Distance. Here again, I noted errors, and a slight improvement, versus the TB Protractor. Things kept getting better, and sounding better, so at least I knew I was headed in the right direction.

Then enter the MintLP Protractor. I like others, took the chance, there was lots of very good buzz about this product, giving good gains in playback performance, and like others here, I wanted to reap those benefits as well.

Of course one might find it hard to shell out $100-$110 for a tool, and be aprehensive-skeptical of its worth, I was a bit at first I admit.

The gains I feel was worth the cost to me. Before, my sound seemed to sound "almost right, not bad, getting better, but was still feeling like something still wasn't just right, or correct". After the careful use of the Mintlp, the sound was improved to the point, that I feel this is now one area, where I haven't induced any incorrect set-up errors, from lack of knowledge, or expertise-experience.

I'm certainly not anywhere near the league of Frank Shroder, who can listen to a Table-Arm Cartridge, hear certain shortcomings in an instant, and quickly, and wisely know "the VTF is too high, VTA is off, there is inner groove distortion being caused by this or that, etc." (in other words, to make a long story short, an average Shmoe like me needs all the help I can get!) This one tool has helped me to better my sound, and to better understand this one facet, the geometrical mechanics of achieving optimum vinyl playback.

Ken Willis, like you, has made very recent mention as well, of perhaps manufacturing a Mirror Arc Protractor. I wish him well in his pursuits, he's a great guy, and helping to provide good tools, and help to the audio community.

As I close, one very unique property of the Mintlp Tractor, is that the Vinyl Overlay on the Glass Mirror is a translucent material, except where the two Null Grids Are. There, the material is trasparent-crystal clear in that area, thus aiding in better ease of accurately sighting of both the Null Points, and the Alignment of Cantilever. This man apparently had his thinking cap on when he made this Tool. Mark

I hear you, Mark. The point I'm trying to make is that, just like everything else in this hobby, there is a a point of diminishing returns from the dollar spent. And I believe a bit of understanding can not only yield great satisfaction in terms of turntable setup, but also save some serious money. Plus, it takes a bit of the mystery out of analog reproduction.

Take a simple free, downloadable arc protractor (with 2 null points) - not unlike the one I've created, take it to Kinkos and have them print it out on an overhead transparancy. This will cost you $0.75 + tax. Make sure they have Page Scaling set to "None".

Then hit a Michael's or Hobby Lobby and purchase a 5" round mirror for $0.99 + tax. Assuming you have an Exacto knife ($4.99 + tax) and a steady enough hand to cut a hole for the spindle, you're probably 99% to 99.9% the way to the MintLP protractor for somewhere between $2 and $8.

I just did this, and quite frankly, even with the parallax advantage of the mirror, I did not change my setup over simply aligning it via a simple printout of the protractor. Maybe I've hit the accuracy limit of this approach. Maybe I just got lucky.

Unfortunately, the overhead transparancies are not crystal clear. I'm going to stay on the lookout for some that are.

My other point I'm trying to make is that we, as a collective, can help educate each-other on some low-cost, common sense things that can improve our systems (like the Mr. Clean Magic Eraser). Assuming I'm not way off-base, if this can help one person improve their turntable setup *without* spending $110, then I feel I've contributed in a positive way to the audio community.

I haope I'm not dragging this thread out, and "wasting" Bandwidth by responding again.

I do agree Nrenter. I'm not at all upset spending what I did for the Mintlp Protractor, he does include a nice Lighted Magnifier, a small trial bottle of record cleaner, and one can bypass the option of Loupe if they choose.

I'm now more sort of sdaddened of the now two uneeded Geodisc, and TB Tractors. which have now become redundant, and are sitting-collecting dust. Of course, they served their purpose for me in the past, and were of course better then using nothing, or a poor printout Tractor.

One thing I failed to mention in my last response, which may also be a benefit for the Mintlp Tractor, or ones that may follow it, is the Mintlp Tractor has a very fine Arc Trace, and literal "microscopic" Null Ticks, and Null Grid Lines, permitting I believe, much better resolution, and fine tuning of this critical alignment.

I feel any Protractor to come along in the future, which would not possess this same ultra fine detail of Alignment respolution will most likely fall short of Yip's Mintlp Protractor.

I totally agree, that not all Vinyl Lovers have front ends that cost what a new BMW cost, and some have very nice Decks-Cartridges, at more down to earth prices.
Yes, it would be nice, that these folks too, could have a tool that is more reasonably priced, is readily available, and will do a very good job.

Right now, I see this option at the present, as Mr. Ken Willis. The more players in the game, the better it gets! Mark

One thing I failed to mention in my last response, which may also be a benefit for the Mintlp Tractor, or ones that may follow it, is the Mintlp Tractor has a very fine Arc Trace, and literal "microscopic" Null Ticks, and Null Grid Lines, permitting I believe, much better resolution, and fine tuning of this critical alignment.

Yeak! Mark you got it
This is the power of MintLP Tractor
You can make a super-very-fine setup , obviously thanks to a good magnifier lens , and when you have finished you are alway sure about the perfect tracking point of your cartridge and you can listen this every time you spin a LP