Analyzing DACs

I’ve tried different scenarios:

Topping D70s dac acting as a preamp straight into a GoldNote PA10. Then a Creek integrated amp acting as a preamp preceded by the same dac switched to pure dac mode, Then eventually purchased an SPL Elector for a dedicated preamp instead of the Creek (same configuration).

This particular dac as pre sounded…pretty good. Decent stage, good clarity, bass weight ok.

with the Creek, sounded…pretty good. Just wider stage, more interesting tonally, but not as fast.

Enter SPL preamp…huge improvement, by several factors, at least. Wider and deeper, more balanced while being more tonally rich, but also more accurate/there. Much more clarity, bass weight, bass quality, presence, center image, believability, pace, speed, dynamics, refinement, smoother. Sometimes even have trouble stopping the music to pee, it’s so good.

It’s interesting how nuanced and variable sampling different components in the chain can become. But to me, a very well designed output stage (or series of very good output stages) can be a game changer.

Topping dac as a dac is great in this arrangement. Better than as a pre/dac. But a Chord Dave as a pre/dac? I would assume a whole other animal much much better than a topping pre/dac. But I’d still stick with my SPL pre, given the choice. Always with the prospect of getting an even better dac down the line.

I would say that the one advantage to following the ASR sheep is that the units recommended by ASR can be resold very quickly and without taking as much of a haircut in the process. 

I was revamping a system last year and the first two units that sold "measured very well".  Those were the units I liked the least and thought would take the longest to sell.

For my next test I am going to try the GD Audio R-27 HE as a preamp/DAC combo.  It fit my needs for where it was going and the sources that would be connected.  Also, their latest DAC did very well in Stereophile which does not usually lavish praise on units in that price point. 

@steakster : congratulations! You are some sleuth! Yes, I am "roberjerman" and I have 4319 posts using that moniker. I suggest you read some of them! I changed my alias here on Agon because I couldn’t log-on when I got a new phone. I did buy a pair of speakers at the Greenwich Village, NYC Crazy Eddy’s in 1976. A pair of Acoustiphase two-ways large boxes - an Advent copy - for $200. I used them for a few months with a Marantz 2270 receiver. Sold them in the spring of ’77 and bought a store-demo pair of Infinity Monitors 1A with Walsh tweeters! By that time I had an AGI 511 preamp, GAS Son of Ampzilla, Mitsubishi DA-F10 tuner and an Empire 698 TT with a Dynavector 20B homc cartridge. How’s that for a late - 70’s high-end system! Speaker wire was Polk Cobra Cable and ICs were Verion Triaxials made by Mitch Cotter.

You buy hifi to listen to it, when buying a component, listen to it.

@larryaa55

A costlier DAC should, at least in theory, produce more accurate output. Specs like ultra-low THD are not very important when considering which DAC to buy. Like I said before, if you can’t hear it, it doesn’t matter. Tons of negative feedback in the circuit and other shortcomings...and many who have not heard a lot of audio gear before are quick to praise it...simply because it produces sound/ouput!!

Ranking by cost alone may not provide the results you want. It’s all about the design topology, quality and longevity ratings of internal parts, protocols, USB controllor specs, and of course the designers intent. Do you want a very detailed DAC? then go hunting for "accurate or resolving DACs" online. A lot of pro audio gear (such as steinburg interfaces, for example are more suited for recordeding and will not reach the same level of performance as a standalone DAC. Once again, cost savings. 

At any rate, software settings on programs such as jriver can alter the sound quality of a DAC in many different ways. If you’ve got a resolving DAC that sounds cold for example, you can easily fixate its tonal quality to be a bit warmer and easier on the ears. The details in the music will still be there...just less obvious or upfront.

I’ve read quite a few of @jasonbourne52 posts, and much of what he says is practical and makes sense.

@tee_dee

Also, from my experience with my current equipment, some tracks are mastered at high levels. I assume the double gain (eg from the DAC and the preamp) exacerbates the loudness. Some tracks sound like screaming vocals. I assume that won’t allow me allow to realize the full potential of the amplifier if I have to listen at low levels.

Right, these folks don’t match for LUFS!! Look this one up...

Other problems include excessive dithering, not converting a CD quality file to 32 bit by 96 KHz or higher, dynamic range compression, Equalization mistakes, etc.

And you’re absolutely right about that. Having to turn down the volume because of problems with loudless won’t allow you to experience full extent of the music.

Which tracks? I’d love to fix them.