Are tubes really “warm”?

I always thought the warm sound associated with tubes came from distortion and HF roll off. 

I always thought the warm sound associated with tubes came from distortion and HF roll off.

The 2nd and 3rd harmonics are responsible for 'warmth', but tubes can have plenty of bandwidth- the old Harmon Kardon Citation 2 had bandwidth to 100KHz and that amp hails from 1959. So the HF rolloff thing is a bit of a myth.

Flipping the coin over for a bit, it is also distortion that causes transistor amps to have brightness and harshness. This is the case even though the distortion in question is quite 'low'. But the ear uses the higher ordered harmonics that cause brightness to sense sound pressure, and so is arguably more sensitive to them than anything else! So even though transistor amps look like they have low distortion on paper, the ear itself doesn't think so and can hear that distortion easily.

mozartfan196 posts05-25-2020 7:33pm

This is the point I am trying to emphasize.
World’s very best ss designs can not match worlds finest tube designs. In all areas of sonic fq resolution/sound stage/live experience.

You’re not emphasizing anything. You’re stating the best power amps, are valve and solid state can’t match valve design.

The top three to boot.

Which 3/3? What are you comparing?

"As I say, I recently auditioned a hefty tube pre (retails @ $3K+) , I do not want to call out the brand. "

If you want a good preamp, 3k might get you there, if you want a GREAT one, you might have to spend a little more than 3K.

I just sent back a little Freya + (1000.00) nice unit. It had a problem. It had 3k sound, not 6-10k sound.. Yes, GREAT sound can cost a lot of money. It doesn’t have to, but it sure can.

"But I do know for a fact there does <<NOT>> exist any ss pre amp in the universe that would even come close to meeting my expectations. "

WOW!!

I’m a Mac guy, I have a SS MX120, that will not only match, but will blow the doors off a LOT of valve preamps. I own a few, mostly Mcintosh, C8s,11,20s,22,2500,MX110s,120s,121,150 (just sold), Krell, Marantz, Cary, VTL, CJ, and two hand made, by me..

I paid 750.00 for it, cracked glass. A pure sonic nugget, especially with planar/ribbon setups.

I picked up a second MX120, the sonics were the same. That MAC unit is one of the best PURE STEREO, pre I ever owned, and it is a 5.1-7.1 surround system. Go figure! 1600.00 for this one.

I've sat a lot of TUBE HEADs in front of that preamp and they KNEW it was all valves, powering the system.
LOL it was all SS. Mac and Pass Lab.. They knew me, right... It had to be valves.. I know I can fool a lot of folks with that set up.. You aught to hear it with a valve power amp, like Cary, or Mac will work..

A buddy has a new SLP 05, he thinks it can do it..we'll see. I bet it's close.  8,000.00 + (he won't say what he spent) - 750.00 LOL with a cracked glass..

Come to find out it is a Stereo front end, with an additional processor.
Not a processor that will do Stereo, but both are onboard.

Listen to the 50 series of Mac.. C50-53? If you had, you wouldn’t make statements like that.

The C45 uses the same front end as 120,150, (there are a few that used it)
I guess that why it is so coveted in the Mac community.

You like valve preamps, (I think), but "know" a SS "does not exist" that would meet your needs.

I found a few that work great for me..

Or save a lot of money and get a great integrated. If I were starting out again, I would sure think about it..

Regards

Here ya go!!
https://www.collectorsweekly.com/articles/could-an-old-school-tube-amp-make-the-music-you-love-sound-better/

I just read it.. Geezzzzz I still have most of the stuff they were showing, shy the MC2300 Mac. I sold mine 20 years ago.. "The Fisher" killer pres
Kits were great too.