Badly recorded albums needing upgrading


My new music system is in place, fairly well burnt in, and speaker placement and other tweaks are coming along. In the process I’ve been learning how much variation there is in the quality of both CD and vinyl recordings. This range in quality was not apparent on my old equipment.

For example, as I go through my old records, I’ve noticed a couple of favorites that are terribly recorded. A well known sub-par recording, Eric Clapton’s (Derek and the Dominoes) "Layla and Other Love Songs" is virtually not listenable. The Stones "Let It Bleed" I’ve had to replace with a Japaneses SACD as Jagger’s vocals sounded like he recorded them with a garbage can over his head. That SACD does sound considerably better, although the vocals on "Gimme Shelter still sound muffled. After some research on site and elsewhere, I just ordered another Japanese SACD of Layla out of the myriad available, which the reviewers said made Layla at least listenable.

Here’ the obvious problem. Both replacements were expensive as CD’a and records go, and I only want to spend that kind or resources on absolute favorite records. I am filling in the rock and roll and R&B portion of my record and CD collection of artists ranging from the Beatles up through the Sex Pistols. Are there any other well known albums like "Let It Bleed" or "Layla" I should avoid, or might already have, that will need to be purchased or bought again in upgraded formats. I’m not asking about obscure groups, but instead more well known artists like the Dead, Hendrix, Aretha Franklin, anything Motown, Janis Joplin, Dylan, Joni Mitchell, Bowie, Roxy Music, The Clash, Talking Heads, etc.

I’ve also been purchasing a lot of vintage jazz, from Ellington through the Weather Report and would like to avoid bad recordings there too. In the jazz realm I’ve been acquiring economical Redbook CD sets like Bill Evans’ 12 Classic Albums, and most recently Wayne Shorter’s entire Blue Note recordings made with RVG (Rudy Van Gelder ) remasters. What I’ve learned so far I to do when purchasing these sets it to avoid those that are made of re-recorded MP3 files. Those sets don’t advertise they are MP3 file based, so I dig around reviews by purchasers who after after getting bilked, expose these recordings labels on Amazon,com Music . If you’ve any of these classic jazz sets or albums or reissue labels I should be avoiding, please let me know.

For example, I’m currently looking to purchase economical multiple album sets of Billie Holiday’s Commodore, Verve, and Decca recordings and would like to know which sets to avoid or conversely which sets are well done.. I like among others Miles Davis, Coltrane, Lester Young, Mingus, Charlie Parker, John McLaughlin, Art Blakely, Chet Baker, Ella Fitgerald, Gerry Mulligan and the like. Again, not obscure recordings or artists. I’d really like to not get burned on substandard recordings too. Si Iif you could forewarn of any particular recordings, or any reissue labels to avoid, please do. Next year I might start to get more Classical Music recordings, but that’s another ball of wax for another day

Maybe this question is too broad or poorly defined but I’d appreciate any help you could provide to avoid disappointment or throw any more cash in the garbage. Thanks, and I’d be pleased to answer any questions to clarify this rambling post.

Mike
skyscraper
I only want to spend that kind or resources on absolute favorite records. I am filling in the rock and roll and R&B portion of my record and CD collection of artists ranging from the Beatles up through the Sex Pistols. Are there any other well known albums like "Let It Bleed" or "Layla" I should avoid, or might already have, that will need to be purchased or bought again in upgraded formats.
... there is a lot to sort out and understand about why any recordings sounds the way it does in any given setting, or because of what went into it while recorded or remastered. It's been interesting to learn about that here and other places from those more intimately involved or knowledgeable about the recording process, and those who know the ins and outs of various pressings and mediums. 

Okay so here's the deal. There's some really bad offenders in the recording quality area like the Rolling Stones, but even they managed to get a few things right here and there, or so at least I am told. Springsteen is another major offender in the Hall of Fame for Great Music Recorded Badly. 

But mostly this is one to take on a case by case basis. A better approach if you really care about recording quality is to start paying attention to the recording and mastering engineers. If you see Doug Sax The Mastering Lab you know its gonna sound good no matter if its Styx Equinox or Linda Ronstadt and Nelson Riddle.

Its a shame you seem only interested in CD because the only foolproof means I know of obtaining ultra high sound quality is to buy from Better-Records.com which although insanely expensive are also insanely good sound quality. Which has so much good solid info on recordings and sound quality its worth a visit even if you only buy CD.
Jond, we’ve similar tastes in jazz. I’ve all the Miles Davis albums you listed except the Collectors Items. The ones I have on CD aren’t K2 issues. They’re only identified as RVG remasters on Prestige. The Monk Plays Duke Ellington is similarly identified not as a K2, only as a Orrin Keepnew’s Collection remaster on Riverside. I recently got Sonny Rollins "Way Out West" as part of a set of his complete Blue Note, Riverside, and Contempory recordings. The Bill Evans 12 album set I recently acquired only overlaps your Everybody Digs Bill Evans recording.

All the above sound really good. I’d be interested in acquiring some of the rest of your list of K2 reissues to make comparisons. I’ll try pulling those up online to get pricing. Same with the MPS Oscar Peterson of whom I’ve unfortunately no recordings with him as bandleader. Thanks.

Millercarbon, I’ll take a look at the Better-Records.com site if only to get tempted. I’d love to have my cake and eat it too, but with so many recordings I desire to acquire I don’t want to get into the "insanely expensive category". I’d rather be able to significantly increase my record and CD collection to encompass many more musical styles and genres. But a few treats now and then from Better-Records would not be out of the question.

Maybe my thought on on the matter will change after a while, but I’ve been looking forward to being in a position to fill out my record collection and (book) library for many years. Now that that day is finally arriving I don’t want to put it off by spending only on the finest recordings, even though they’d be great to have. I don’t buy first editions of books either for similar reasons, and similarly set a budget for excellent, but certainly not the finest available, stereo equipment.

I also tried getting used records locally and there is still one remaining store locally selling them, but it was a crap shoot finding decent condition ones. Are there any other recording engineers other than Doug Sax whose records you like and would recommend, that would help someone to identify well recorded music. I’ve got Layla’s recording engineer, Tom Dowd, permanently blacklisted.

By the way my new Japanese SHM SA-CD 2013 Layla remaster came in the mail today and is playing at this moment. It’s not great, but manages to be listenable as advertised. The bass is boomy and Clapton sounds like he’s singing in an echo chamber next door, but it’s a significant improvement. Turning up the volume while decreasing the bass is helping a bit. It’s such a lovely album though. Kind of like viewing DaVinci’s Last Supper, where even though over half of the original paint is missing you can still appreciate you’re looking at a masterpiece. Take it easy,

Mike
skyscraper-
Revisiting Derek and the Dominoes-Layla

If you're serious about record play, cut to the chasehttps://www.better-records.com/product.aspx?pf_id=dereklayla_2002_1
If my table alone, were a $50K+, I wouldn't think twice buying my favorites from here.

The owner of this establishment  used to send his scouts to scoop up potential "stampers" from one of my neighborhood stores.

I have the $500 Pretzel Logic, (found after several $3-5 buys)$300, $600 Stones LIB etc.

I played my copy of Layla...clean, but yeah,some of  what Tom Port describes of a typical copy. Some of his descriptions are IMO, a little much, but he does a good job of "selling the copy"

I forgot how wonderful the entire album is.The cover of Little Wing is cool.


If you are looking for the early Rolling Stones (up to Let it Bleed), buy those 2002 SACDs and that is it. As geoffkait mentioned, they are relatively cheap (eBay, etc.) but the prices have actually gone up recently. Just make sure you get SACDs and not DSD remasters on CD. Digipak (cardboard) is what you are looking for, not the plastic jewel case. Both will say DSD on the back.

Talking Heads had DVD-Audio (ouch, I mentioned it) of Remain In Light and Fear Of Music. They were as good as they could be, especially taking into consideration the original sound signature of Fear Of Music. Otherwise, buy a good record and be done.

As plaw mentioned, Roxy Music’s Avalon SACD is good, and I would say that all Bob Dylan SACDs from 2003 are a great bet.

If you do listen to Bruce Springsteen, Nebraska from 2014/2015 is strangely good. Really good.

And last, if you are a Procol Harum fan, or even if you are not, their first album on Classic Records re-release from, I believe, 2003 is what you want to buy today. You want the copy with a 7" single of A Whiter Shade Of Pale stereo included. It should have three records in the package. Album, 12" A Whiter Shade Of Pale mono (33 and 45 rpm), and this 7" single. It will not be the cheapest record you have ever bought, but you will like it. The only problem is that you may start considering buying a mono cartridge.



https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2047675.m570.l1313.TR1.TRC0.A0.H0.Xrolling+st...


https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bob-Dylan-Limited-Edition-Hybrid-SACD-Set-Box-CD-15-Discs-2003-Sony-6059/33...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/15-CD-Box-Set-BOB-DYLAN-Limited-Edition-Hybrid-SACD-Set/303435176021?hash=i...

https://www.discogs.com/sell/release/681547?sort=price%2Cdesc&ev=rb

https://www.discogs.com/Bruce-Springsteen-Nebraska/release/6914245

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/classic-records-procol-harum

Actually I always get the DSD CDs, not the SACDs. Did I make a boo boo? The DSD sound great. Am I going deaf? Is the CD layer on hybrid DSD SACDs also DSD?