2. amps-preamps
  3. 131837-527

I need help, please? Listening to my system through music!

Hey all,

Please indulge me as I'm having an audio/identity crisis of sorts here. Maybe you can empathize, maybe it's just first world problems.

So, for several years up until earlier this summer, I was more or less happy and content with my audio set up:
  • Acoustic Zen Adagios
  • LSA Statement integrated (I tube rolled it)
  • Jolida JD9 Mk2 phono
  • Oppo 105 BDP
  • VPI HW19 Mk4 with Benz Ace cartridge
  • AZ and Decware cabling

It was my steady system for about 3 years after going through different many speaker/amp/tt/ combinations.

And then, based on several conversations with AZ founder Robert Lee and several Audiogon members, I became convinced that I needed to go the SET route for my Adagios. I auditioned Steve Deckerts' Decware amps and liked what I heard, but Mr. Lee recommended Triode Corp. amps, so when one popped up on Audiogon I grabbed it and sold my LSA Statement.

Now, the LSA is an understated star in the integrated world; it's a hybrid, dual-mono platform, perfected by Larry Staples and John Tucker of Exemplar Audio and delivers 150w of transparent power. The Triode Corp is a pure tube, 35w SET design with good reviews and Mr. Lee's endorsement. I tube rolled the input tubes in the Triode and then let it burn in for a while, even though I bought it used from a reputable Audiogon dealer.

Result? The bass the LSA delivered is missing. There's also clipping/distortion on the higher end. I took it to the local audio shop who biased everything and checked connections, etc. and gave it the thumbs up. But same result. It's a different sound than the LSA. It's not bad, per se; it's just not a full or comprehensive or satisfying. had I not had the LSA, I would have been pretty happy with the Triode.

You don't know what you got 'til it's gone.

MAYBE as a result, I really don't listen to music as much as I used to, if at all. I can't remember the last time I went on Discogs or to the local music store or even ordered any music on Amazon. I can't remember the last time I went down to my listening room and just enjoyed a recording. So, my questions are:

  1. Am I just over-reacting? And should I just sell the Triode and go for another amp and get over it? I'd rather not get the LSA again; I hate gong back to something I once had.
  2. Is hi-end audio, a hobby for the last 20 years, receding like many things do in our lives and now is no longer as paramount as it used to be?
  3. Is this a classic case of someone using music to listen to their system?
  4. Anyone else have these audiophile mid-life crisis issues?

Thanks for your patience and insight.

Warm regards,

Simao




128x128simao
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,227 posts
 
I’ve heard the Triode Corp amplifiers with the Acoustic Zen Crescendos and the sound was superb. However in your case you aren’t happy with the sound and most importantly you are listening less to music. I would sell the amplifier and return to your prior amplifier. You must trust what you hear. You were happy with the LSA  Statement amplifier.
Charles
hifiron
102 posts
 
Well I think there are two things going on here...

1. Subconsciously you're not listening to music because you don't enjoy the reproduction you're hearing. It is like listening to Pandora, at least for me, I can't do it.

2. You may have a pairing issue with your amp/speakers. There are some great amps that just pair very poorly with some speakers and vice versa.

I have a Decware Torii Jr. which is very forgiving of the speakers attached, it is paired with an HR-1 and man they just sound sublime. However I bet there are some that wouldn't enjoy the reproduction of my system because they are hybrid radials.

I would make a list of what you're looking for in your music reproduction, think about what you enjoy most of listening to music. When you close your eyes, what gives you goosebumps?

Post the list back here, and then lets come up with some ideas.
kalali's avatar
kalali
1,977 posts
 
I'm not familiar with your gear but when I upgraded my amplifier's power cord and installed a dedicated 20 amp circuit for the amp, the bass response noticeably improved. Not saying day and night difference but definitely audible.  
YMMV.
glennewdick's avatar
glennewdick
1,500 posts
 

I'm wondering what Triode Corp amp you got that is 35wch SET, I don't see any thing close to that power in a SET on the site. Some nice looking PP amps at that Watt range.

Also your speakers are only rated at 89db, the speakers web site says 6ohms nominal impedance,  but for SET that's really not efficient enough you need upwards of 94-95db to really make it work even then closer to 100db is better.


I think you have classic under powered situation. like others have said you need 50-100wch. I would not give up on tubes though done well they can truly sound great.  look to AR, Cary, CJ, etc for more tube power. Class A solid state I bet would sound great too. Luxman, Acuphase, PassLabs, etc. in that 30-50wch Class A ss would work well.  

simao's avatar
simao OP
1,715 posts
 
Thank you all, for the sage advice and questions. The Triode in question is a Triode Corp TRV-88SE. It’s a push-pull design, not an SET and, based on all the advice and evidence, it looks as if it just may not be powerful enough for the Adagios. Mr. Lee said anything 35wpc or over would suffice, but it’s still a huge decrease from 150wpc, especially if that 45wpc of the TRV-88SE is PP and not SET.

Idk; I’m probably talking out of my a-- here. I do know, though, that the sound is def. not as easy or full as before. I wonder if it’s also a poor match for the Jolida phono? I’ve tried all the different loadings the Jolida offers, though the Benz is rated at 47K ohms.

Ironically enough, my very same LSA Statement is now for sale here on Audiogon from the buyer I sold it to, though I’m not in a financial position to buy it this month.
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