Harshness in tweeters: the price of transparency?


Hi,

I can't help notice a correlation between ultimate tweeter transparency and having to put up with harshness at loud volume levels. It can be very transparent and smooth to an appreciable volume, bit exceed that and it will go harsh if you apply the materials necessary for max transparency in those drivers.

I owned titanium dome tweeters in Avalon Eclipse speakers that ultimately caused me a case of a decade-long bout with tinnitus from the titanium dome tweeters, even when using a smooth Music Reference RM-9 tube amp.

I then owned a pair of horns with lightweight metal compression driver diaphragms. Again, unbearable harshness at loud levels where the metal "breaks up".

I now own a pair of beryllium dome tweeeters in speakers that again are volume limited before that metallic glare and harshness comes in. When I had silk domes none of that happened to me, but the details and transparency are markedly down for those drivers at all volumes.

The most transparent drivers I heard were the best tweeter horns but at the cost of harshness. They exceeded electrostatics for dynamics and transparency and detail, but at that cost. Electrostatics seem to me to be the best compromise in midrange on up detail and smoothness but with a real decline in dynamics.

Maybe diamond is the answer with its extreme rigidity and hardness. But I'm not rich enough for that yet, and probably never will be.

What's the scoop on the best tweeters out there for all of what I'm asking for here, but at a reasonable price? One possibility that intrigues me is the ceramic tweeter, but again, I don't know and those are not cheap either.

I want to play horns and cymbals loud and clear, without that bite in my ear. Soft domes aren't enough for me, at least not the ones I've heard after hearing horns and beryllium.
ktstrain
Dave, Oh and lest I forget - Robbie WIlliams "Swing while your winning"" - great sound! Another one for the "demo" collection - if you love a realistic brass sound with a bit of "bite". Or Sante Fe and the Fat City Horns or Strokeland Superband or Phat Phunction
maybe you should take a vaction from cones. try a different design and perhaps use a tube amp. dipole treble vs cone treble has been discusssed many times before.

i am not a fan of cones but those i can live with are silk dome or the "old" copper dome celestion tweeter.
Great suggestions. I've got the ToP on D2D Sheffeild Lab. "What Is Hip" and "Squibcakes" are a couple of my all-time favs. There's an effect on "Squibcakes" where some sound flies around the room and goes behind my head, in two-channel.

With ToP, newbies need to be careful and get HRCDs or D2D versions. I've got a greatest hits CD that truly sucks, due to poor production.

Robbie Williams is a new one for me, the hunt begins...

Dave
Yes, Gallo Ref. 3s do what you want - crystal clear with no hardness. One of the best tweeters ever made...

-RW-
As previously stated, titanium did not cause your tinnitus; prolonged exposure to LOUD music, noises, or illness caused your condition. An interesting 1970's study that few know about correlate loud noise combined with STRESS as the major factors in hearing problems.

As others have stated, think of your room as an integral part of your sound system. Once the dB's start reaching insane levels, room treatments & tweaks are mandatory!!!

I paid close attention to the "tweak factor". Even so, I believe that most rooms have a maximum dB level, were the sound starts to "fall apart". For my set-up, that was about 108-110 dB peaks at my listening chair.