which preamp


thinking of buying a tube preamp,have it down to,
AUDIO HORIZONS balanced with full mods or TRL DUDE balanced I only play CDs with PS AUDIO new DSD , DSD direct to wyred4s SX1000 monos, dose anyone have these preamps and what are your opinions ? which way to go !!!!
smokenjo
I own the Audio Horizons. I play vinyl and CD's which sound wonderful. My amp is Mac 352, my CD player is Audio Research CD3 MkII and the speakers are Tyler Acoustics Signature. My Audio is not the fully tricked out model but I put it against a Audio Research Ref 2 and chose the Audio. All in all, I am quite happy. Hope this helps. Steve
"thinking of buying a tube preamp,have it down to,"

How did you narrow it down to those 2 preamps? What did those 2 do right that made you pick them over other choices? Knowing that would help in making recommendations.
I wish I could hear these preamps,but I can not, until I get the one I decide on in my system, I want a true balanced pre and from the reviews that I have read on different forums, on price and performance these 2 preamps seem to compare to preamps costing much more money also some may have more options etc.I don"t need them, I want a 3D soundstage, tight base, clean clear highs not a forward in your face soundstage, both of these preamps costing close to the same $6200 to $6800, and both are direct purchase from the manufacture

What other people say about these preamps really isn't all that relevant. If you get something without listening to it first, you're far more likely to fail than succeed. The preamp is the most important component to get right. If not, you'll just go crazy trying to fix your system.
I agree the audio horizons has a in home addition,I have heard the McIntosh C2300 preamp, has a nice soundstage, lite on bottom and top end, but is not a true balanced preamp, hard to find dealers who have tube preamps to hear and compare
I have the Audio Horizons preamp -- fully loaded. I am very happy with it. But you need to roll the right tubes. I am now using a NAD M51 DAC but I have a PS Audio DS DAC arriving next week.
I would auditition the TRL Dude pre-amp, I have heard many, many good things about this unit, I know a couple of members here that have did mods to the Dude with great success!, from tube rolling to top tier caps in sections of the unit, stock is hailed as very good too, for the money, if I were to go active, it would be on my short list to audition, cheers.
Neither. In that price range I would go for a good 2nd hand Aesthetix Janus Signature then upgrade it with Jupiter copper foil in wax caps & NOS tubes like Grannyring. Best bang for the buck "under $25k" imho.
as I said before not many audio stores in south florida, so to audition tube preamps is difficult,and to find a balanced tube pre that is in my price range. THE TRL dose not have a in home audition,so to read what other forums have to say about reviews of different preamps is helping my decision
"10-11-14: Smokenjo
as I said before not many audio stores in south florida, so to audition tube preamps is difficult,and to find a balanced tube pre that is in my price range. THE TRL dose not have a in home audition,so to read what other forums have to say about reviews of different preamps is helping my decision"

I understand where you are coming from, but buying a preamp without listening to it, especially tubes, is very risky. Have you tried Wellington Audio? He's in South Florida and has quite a bit of tube gear on display. There's no problem at all with bringing your current gear into the store and trying it with whatever he has. It's definitely worth the drive. Also, try The Cable Company. There's a good chance they may have a preamp to lend you.
Zd542,

I agree about listening to a preamp before buying it. But it is not just a matter of tube products and risk. If you don't roll the right tubes in the preamp you may think you have a dud where you may actually have a jewel -- if you only knew.
Consider Coincident Statement Linestage. Owned a lot of pre amps, this one makes you forget you're listening to electronics.
SABAI,I have PS AUDIO DSD dac, great detail I am sure you will love it,what amp do you have, my are wyred4 sx1000 mono"s which AUDIO HORIZONS preamp TP 2.3 the dsd has balanced and single ended outputs
"I agree about listening to a preamp before buying it. But it is not just a matter of tube products and risk. If you don't roll the right tubes in the preamp you may think you have a dud where you may actually have a jewel -- if you only knew.
Sabai (Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)"

While its possible that something like that can happen, I don't see why a demo would be any less important. Also, most people don't roll tubes, and its highly unlikely that you'll demo a new tube product at an authorized dealer with anything other than stock tubes in it.
Rough buying a tube pre unless you have a tube tester.
On and off swaping of 8 tubes to find the one that has developed a hisssssss is hard on your system and YOUR system.
I have a fully balanced TRL Dude and am extremely happy with it. Paul Weitzel is a telephone call away (like last night, Sunday) if you have a problem/question. I have had some great preamps: ML 32, Atma-Sphere MP-1, Aesthetix Calypso, EAR 868, C-J 14, 16 LS and so far it is my favorite, just because it does everything so well. Havent heard the Audio Horizons, though.
Smokenjo,

I have an Atma-Sphere S-30. My DS DAC arrives tomorrow.

Zd542,

You're right about stock tubes, alas.
SABAI, let me know what you think about the PS DSD, AND WHICH AUDIO HORIZONS preamp do you have and what tubes do you like are you going to run the ps DSD balanced,mine is direct to monos balanced
Sabai,

Bear in mind the PS DS DAC requires at least 50 hrs of burn in to begin sounding like it will, and 100 to reach orime state. I think you will find it a breathtaking experience.

Neal
I have my PS-DSD from the second week of production and it has been sounding better an better, also they PS AUDIO has upgraded the firm ware 2 times, FOR FREE, just put a SD card in you PC AND DOWN LOAD FROM THEIR FORUM, WHAT OTHER COMPANY GIVES YOU UPGRADES FOR FREE
Smokenjo,

I have the TP 2.3 fully loaded. I use Siemens Cca in 1 and 3 and Siemens E188CC in 2 and 4. The latter is the secret to this preamp. I'll let you know how the DS sounds in a couple of days. Of course, this is right out of the box. It will take about 500 hours to break in. I have the new 1.2.1 firmware ready on my SD card.

Nglazer,

I'm hoping to have the same reaction as you.
Nglazer and Smokenjo,

I just took the NAD M51 out and put the DS DAC into the system. Powered up with the old firmware. Nothing spectacular right out of the box -- slightly ahead of the NAD, perhaps. Then I put the new 1.2.1 firmware to work. Powered up again. The NAD M51 is a great DAC -- a wonderful bargain at its price point -- but it is now retired. This DS is a whole different DAC with the latest firmware -- right out of the box. Already a superb DAC. I can't wait till we get 500 hours on it.
sabai , I am not surprised and glade you are hearing a upgrade to your system with the new PS DSD, can I ask with the AUDIO HORIZONS PREAMP, how is the soundstage, 3D, deep ,
wide, bass, highs I know you just put in the new DSD, but I am trying to decided if I should purchase the TP-2.3 FULL
MODE $6200 , right now with NO preamp, I close my eyes,the speakers disappear, detail, my speakers are Salk SS8s
Smokenjo,

The TP 2.3 fully loaded was a huge improvement in my system even before the DS DAC arrived. I cannot imagine my system without it.

Regarding sound stage, it is a wide and deep 3D stage with great imagining. But you must know that sound stand depends on more than the preamp (rolled with the best tubes) and DAC. Your speaker and power amp and cables and accessories including tweaks can have a huge impact here, as well. I have a zillion things in my system that contribute to sound stage.
sabai , thanks for the info. tube preamp and tube amp,I know the end product , is and will be different than mine , tube to D class amps.
Enjoy, Sabai.

What are you feeding it with? And what cable(s) to and from? In/out cables make an enormous difference.

Neal
Nglazer,

I am feeding it organic grain-fed beef. That's why the harmonics are superior.

Actually, I am using my own DIY cables in series with Shunyata.
Sabai,

I thought organic beef was grass-fed, not grain-fed. So you had best take another look at your cables and check on harmonics for antibiotics.

Neal
Nglazer,

Make that organic grain-fed grass. My cabling is great, thanks.
"10-15-14: Sabai
Nglazer,

I am feeding it organic grain-fed beef. That's why the harmonics are superior.

Actually, I am using my own DIY cables in series with Shunyata."

As far as the grain goes, you can get further improvements using vintage, pre acid rain seeds, and grow them in a controlled environment.

With your cables running in series, do you just connect them randomly and see what sounds the best, or is there some type of strategy involved? The reason I ask is that I heard some cables that are a copper/silver alloy, and they don't sound like copper or silver. It was just a very interesting sound that I didn't expect. I was wondering if you can get the same type of sound running copper and silver cables in series, or is it the alloy that makes the difference.
Zd542,

Sometimes the Shunyata works best downstream and sometimes my DIY Furutech works best downstream. You need to reverse them to see which configuration sounds best.

The Furutech wire contains no silver. I am not aware if the Shunyatas contain silver. I think what makes this series work is that both cables are made from OCC copper that has been cryogenically treated. Why they create such an amazing sound together is a mystery to me. The Shunyatas sounded great before I decided to experiment with series cabling here. But since trying the series idea it is clear the harmonics of the Shunyatas fall short in my system. This may be a system dependent thing. As I mentioned earlier, my DIY cables do not work at all in series with my Elrods.

I have just introduced the PS Audio DS DAC into my system this week. I will be going back, cable by cable, to verify if the series still works as well as it did with my NAD M51 or if I need to make any changes.
I would find a used First Sound if you come acroos one in your travels.If not those are fine choices also,good luck,B