Which integrated Amp for Vandersteen 2ce Sig2 ?

Am currently using a Marantz PM15S1 to drive these speakers - very bright, airy, detailed BUT thin and once its gets into symphony / orchestra music, its messy. Otherwise, for simple femalevocals and jazz, its beautiful.

Hv auditioned the below

- Ayre 7xe
- BAT vx300
- Marantz PM11S1
- NAD M3
- Luxman L-590u Class A
- Musical Fidelity A5.5
- Musical Fidelity A1

Price increase simply cannot justify the sound improvement....am now looking at the below -

Pass Labs int-150
Gryphon Diablo
Luxman L-590u

Any comments ....
my initial thought is that this is a speaker placement problem. any detail about placement?
Call Audio Connection in Verona New Jersey ask for John.

He is the expert.
I have 2CE's (the older version) and have heard the new ones. They are not bright speakers, rather they are a bit on the warm side of the fence. In addition, Marantz gear's "house sound" is warm and usually slightly rolled off at the top to my ear. So you have two warm items added together and are getting thin, cold sound - something doesn't add up. The previous poster suggested speaker placement - these speakers are hard work to place properly - I Can possibly give you some tips.

What is your source?
Thank you guys - for all ur response.

I am using a Vintage Marantz CD15 without any DAC.

I am basically v happy with the way my system sounds now except when it starts playing complicated CDs (symphony, orchestra) tats when it gets messy and in my chain, i can only point towards my integrated amp as being the weak link - PM15S1 - while its marvelleous at rendering JAZZ and VOCALS (esp females), its a little short on bass...

Or maybe its just the upgrading bug : ) - come to think abt it, its slightly insane that i hv auditioned so many pieces of amps and yet to decide on 1. PERHAPS and v likely, the JAPANESE sound indeed have grown on me such that all the US amps sound so different ....
The amps i had refused are all i hv auditioned b4. The amps i had shortlisted are the ones i had NOT auditioned b4. Seems 'grass is greener on the other side' syndrome is setting in now...

nonetheless, from the many amps that i had auditioned, 2 left the most impression (can say BEST)

- Luxman L-590u - class A
- BAT vx300 - hybrid tube solid state

after all these trials, can finally conclude that Jap vs US integrated amps enjoy 2 different sonic signatures just like TUBE vs SOLID STATES. It may be difficult to switch once u are USED to one....i think the typical laid back Jap sound has caught on me rather than the brute US sound ... and on the notion that i prefer more power, Luxman L509u it shall be... : )
I have heard the Rogue Cronus integrated amp (new at $1795)with the Vandersteen 2C Signatures at Audio Connection in NJ and the results were absolutley sublime. I have never owned Vandersteens, and my system is far more costly, but I have to say when I heard that system, I asked myself "do I really need anything more" as it was so musically satisfying.
Include the Rowland Concentra...one of the best ever.
Agree with Raindance about placement. Assuming you have the Sound Anchors stands, make sure you have the tilt-back set appropriately for the distance of your listening position and height of your ears from the floor. If the speakers are too upright the tweeter might be emphasized as it aims at your ears--and you can lose the speakers' time coherence.

At a distance of eight feet and with a low couch, my 2ceSig2s are tilted back three inches (the manual explains this procedure well), which was a night and day difference over two inches. You'll hear everything cohere when you get it right.
hi ablang

the sound that i am hearing is nice, what is the signifacnt dififernce when it cohere and u got it right?


If any other Vandie users can jump in with their experience, I'd be happy, but my sense of it when I got it right was that there was an overall balance to the sound--a smoothness from top to bottom, with nothing exaggerated or edgy at all. With the tweeters aimed too directly at your ears, you might hear a disjointedness between the treble and mids, even as if the frequencies are coming from different depths within the soundstage--and the treble can certainly be accentuated.

I'm listening to Kenny Burrell's Midnight Blue right now, and the only thing even at a high volume that has any edge to it is the few moments where Burrell's guitar clips his amp--and that's only natural to the sound of a loud, clean electric guitar being pushed to its dynamic limits. If I lift up off my seat, the cymbals and guitar take on a flat, harsh texture. Settle back in, they're smooth as can be. I think the time-alignment might actually best be heard in the "air" on recordings--it seems like a part of the whole cloth of the sonic picture when it's right, and almost like grain otherwise.

If it helps, from where I'm sitting right now, looking through the grill cloth at the white wall behind, the angle of the top of the mid-driver's cabinet is aimed at or just above my ear-level. That's hit it just right for me. Try messing with the tilt-back an inch or half an inch at a time, and see what sounds right. Heretical as it might be to say, if all else fails you might try dialing back the treble driver on the back of each speaker by a dB or more, which I do for some "hot" rock or pop recordings; it doesn't suck out any particular frequency like an eq, it just draws down the whole range of that driver's volume. The graphs on the Stereophile review show this pretty well.

Hope this helps--and happy listening.

thank u very much - think that is just about the most detailed experience i hv ever come across for the 2cesig2 - i will try and revert.

btw, what set up are u using in ur system?

I am not using an integrated amp but, I agree that tilt placement is critical If I stand the sound flattens out but, in my normal sweet spot they are about the easiest most accurate sounding speaker that i have ever listened to. They do not color the sound, voices do not sound boxy or nasal and i do not get listening fatigue. They put out what you put in. In my experience, every improvement seems to bring out more. I have the TAD 150 signature the TAD 125 monoblocks, the Eastern Electric CD player and two TAD subs.
art80342, did you audition the Pass Integrated?

If you're asking about associated equipment, my setup is more modest than yours--the Vandies with an NAD C372 fed by a Sony Playstation 1 (I know, I know, but I'd replace it if there was a single thing wrong with its sound). If you mean room setup, I'll echo again what Eagleman6722 said about tilt back. For initial room placement, I used the Vandersteen manual's room measurement suggestions, then moved them around from there and adjusted tilt-back till everything cohered as I described. Good luck with it.

i did nt audition the pass int150 yet,,,, :(
Dear all,

for the records - I bought the SUPERNAIT from NAIM !

It way surpassed the MARANTZ PM15S1 in terms of imaging, sound stage, bass and transparenc BUT its too loud .... I cannot put a thumb on the sound ... its a totally different animal!
Naits are great, especially for the money. How many watts in the Super Nait?
hee hee...for the records again, i have traded in the supernait for the

BAT vk300x ... now happily a BAT user .....

maybe the pre power - bat vk3ix and vk55 soon. but somehow, not sure if sonically its worth the additional $$$. the bat vk300x is like one of its kind in the BAT family INSTEAD of the entry level pre power : (
Glad you found your cup of tea.