Josh,
Doesn't a wirewound rheostat have enough inductance to change things.....and not necessarily for the better? |
What shortcomings in your panels are you trying to address?
Do you have crossover schematic?
My 1.6s improved quite a bit just by rotating them in place.....
That puts the tweeter 'in' and the mylar facing the rear wall. Apparently, the mylar to the rear is how all Magnepans were made up until fairly recently. Maybe when the QR tweeter was introduced? I have yet to hear / read a convincing reason for this change. |
My 1.6 'tweak' has be limited to rotating the panels in place. I now have the mylar facing away from me and the pole piece is facing me. I feel this has evened out any hi-end stridency, so I don't even think about the resistor in the tweeter and the sweet spot is much larger. I don't know when....or WHY, but Magnepans once were this way, but probably about the time of the QR tweeter, they rotated them to 'mylar front'....
Tweeters on the 'inside' didn't hurt, either, though one day I'll swap 'em side to side and see how tweeter OUT works with the panels rotated...... |
I have mitigated the 'brightness' by flipping the panel so I am listening to the pole piece side, NOT the mylar side.
Magnepan made the swap some years ago and I have yet to hear a plausible reason. Maggies USED to be pole piece to the listener but they changed. My original MG-1s were this way and sounded fine.
After the 'swap' my panels are now better balanced, bigger sweet spot and tremendous center image stability.
I believe part of the change is due to the fact that the bass part of the driver and the tweeter are wired electrically out of phase. The low pass is first order and the hi pass is 2nd order crossover, which is 90 degrees apart. So, when I put the tweeter IN, I changed something.
I could check this by swapping the panels left / right while leaving the mylar facing away from me. That's next! |
Glad you at least gave the pole piece forward a try. Cheap and easy.
Sorry you didn't have a positive experience. Mine will stay rotated and be installed that way sometime in '11, when I can build new hardwood frames. |
What kind of JUMPERS? Mine are untouched since purchase and are daily in my sight since rotating the panels.
Did you try the rotate yet? With the (positive) effects I noted, I heartily recommend that move. Mine are NEVER going back and when I reframe to all-wood, that's the way they will be mounted.
You tell ME what you hear, so I don't bias you in advance of 'test'. |
Keyonka,
When you put your tweeters 'in', did you rotate the panel in place or do a L/R swap?
I did the rotate in place, the tweeters are now 'in' and I am listening to the pole piece side, NOT the mylar. Big change for the better! |
For purposes of a test, you can ignore the directions. Try any and all of the 4 logical ways they can be arranged.
1. mylar to listener, tweeters out (per directions)
2. Swap 'em L/R for mylar to listener, tweeters IN.
3. Rotate in place: results in mylar away, tweeters out
4. Swap em back L/R for tweeters IN and mylar away from listener.
#1 is Magnepan preferred.
#4 is the way I have my panels.
I'll go with whatever YOU prefer, in your system! It's too easy NOT to try, don't you think?
My original MG-1s were mylar away. I am told that sometime in the '90s, Magnepan decided to face the mylar TO the listener.
This will be the cheapest tweak you EVER try. Even removing the fuse will cost a few grams of solder and the electricity to heat up your soldering iron.
OH, each swap will require a little effort to optimize. When I did the rotate, they fell so naturally into place I have yet to mess with them again. But, I've been setting up panels for a long time and can get 'em pretty close to perfect in pretty good time. Perfect setup? takes longer. |
I read the 1.7 manual on the magnepan website. Tweeters in! you bet!
Mylar front is how they come.....which puts the connection panel in back, safely out of tripping range and sight.
I'd try it both ways....ALL 4, actually, since you can either do a L/R swap or a simply rotation-in-place.
That give 4 logical ways to place 'em....any of which may yield the best results in any given room. |
Utley,
You may want to try 'em all 4 ways........
Tweeters can go in or out....with a simple side-to-side swap.
Than you can 'rotate' them in place and do it again.
Personally? Not that it matters to you or your situation, I find tweeters IN and mylar back to be my ticket. This is opposite of Magnepan recommendation.
When I rotated my 1.6s, the entire presentation improved.
No matter what, I urge you to ignore the directions and just try the other possible orientations. I agree that I don't particularly like seeing the plug in panel or wires sticking 'out', but the sound is eyes closed so much better that I simply will ignore the visual, until I can do a reframe.
Any chance your panels were simply mis-packed? What are you suspecting? A dealer return sold to you as new? |
WSlam.
Just keep any drunks from knocking them over.
On a Serious note, check out MYE stands. They have a following and the claims are reasonable.
Also, Magnepan is a DIY dream speaker. Crossover? Stands? Reframe? all have followers.
I recently rotated my panels in place. I now listen to the Pole Piece side, not the mylar as Magnepan would have you do. Read my other posts for a description / rave.
That being said, a complete reframe in WOOD is in order. Wood absorbs the vibration which the MDF rejects.
I'm taking a woodshop class right now, and next year at this time will be well under way in my 'project'. Some nice Sapele frames and junk out the MDF. |
Good for you, Josh.
Try 'em all 4 ways for that matter....tweeter in / out and Mylar front/back.
I wonder if Magnepan started shipping with the tweeter resistor at about the same time as they flipped 'em to pole piece back?
I've tried absolute phase swapping and hear little difference on MOST material.
My sub, however, appreciated the phase switch being flipped after I rotated the panels.....Makes perfect sense. |
Sure? Why not a pair of 1 1/2 ohm in parallel....or a pair of 1 ohm? Many practical combinations exist to put less than 1ohm in series w/the tweeter.
Just think about the resistor in this fashion:
If the driver is 4 ohms, and you put 1 ohm in series with it, roughly 20% of the power will go away...as heat, while the driver gets less power and doesn't play as loud.
You could put 0.1ohm in series and still get an effect, though the 2%+ of power now being dissipated by the resistor may not make an audible difference. |
Yeah, Josh, I was being a stinker. The company I worked for and Vishay had a couple million dollar disagreement, so I'm not big on Vishay products.....
Now, about those awful jumpers.
The ones on my 1.6s are MAGNETIC, which as near as I can tell means steel.
I'm making replacements from 6ga copper wire, and whittled into shape.
First pair done and installed.
Does the 1.7 STILL use this jumper type? What have others done? Please don't suggest biwire....unless you can also tell me how to rid myself of those banana plugs, too.
sheesh. |
No jumpers like I'm accustomed to on my 1.6s? |
People are saying you can't bi-wire the 1.7....this means NO jumpers, right?
That's why I asked.
If I had a look at the crossover schematic for the 1.7 it would be easier to decide if you could bi-wire and how much butchering you'd have to do.
Try the Revel's against the 20.1s and you may change your preference....and get to keep your Krells. Or maybe swap the Krells out for top Bryston or Pass.... |
