"but you get a very big band for your buck." Great typo - experiencing the music indeed; I love big band music!
Congratulations on a stunning looking and, apparently, equally stunning sounding turntable. It is at least $20000 out of my reach (and that's without a tonearm or cartridge) , but it is always nice to read reviews from happy owners.
Oops ! Holly, thanks for pointing out my typo. I think I'll leave it. One thing I would like to point out about TTW turntables is that because of their modular design you are able to upgrade the table without buying a completely new table when new products or technologies become available, which I feel is a huge advantage for the consumer. This allows your analog system to grow as your financial situation changes. Another thing I like about TTW products is that the cutting edge technologies do get integrated into their entry and mid level turntables.
I've had 2 TTW tables and could not listen b/c they would not hold a steady stable speed this confirmed by the Timeline. YMMV
Sksos1 you must of had a early design of the speed controller and motor
that was only available for a very short time. The motor supplier was
changed because of poor quality control.
Benjie: was it a timeline laser that you used to confirm speed? If not, what did you use? If so, could you video the tt in action with the timeline and link it to the timeline database thread here
. It would be a welcome and instructive addition to that thread.
I used an industrial laser tachometer. We use them at work to check the rpm of machines. Speed of the equipment is very critical where I work. I don't own a timeline or know anyone who has one.
Did you upgrade your V1 to V2 status, or purchase a new V2 outright? If the former, what parts are changed besides the platter and motor controller? What arm are you using?
I upgraded from V1 to V2. The V1 momentus already had the upgraded motor and the plinth had the new custom bearing so I just needed the copper platter and the new motor controller. Like I said in an earlier post, the nice thing about TTW turntables is that they are upgradable with their modular design.
The tone arm I am using is the new Graham Phantom II Supreme with a Benz LP S cartridge.
Benjie, What happens to your laser tachometer reading when you lower the
needle into the grove? And do you see any variation during dynamic musical
passages? Many owners of laser tachs praise their accuracy, but I could never
get mine to change the reading despite slight changes in load. My TimeLine
clearly shows this. I have a belt drive table, so it may be more susceptible to
changes in speed consistency, while your DD table may be immune to any
variation so it might not show up on the tach reading.
I watched Sksos1's tests of the TTW tables and their speed was not good. That
was just less than 2 years ago. I'm glad they have solved this problem with
Peterayer, nothing happens when I lower the tonearm onto the
record. The speed stays steady at 33.3 or 45.0. The platter,
center weight and outer ring weigh about 93 lbs. Once the
platter gets up to speed which takes about 6 or 7 second and
locks in on the set speed the inertia of that much weight
turning is not effected by stylus drag.
The Walker turntable is the same way. Lloyds platter weighs
in at about 70 lbs and he has a unique motor and controller
system that once set to the desired speed is not effected by
stylus drag. Both systems are rock solid.
I don't understand why some people on this forum are so
obsessed with the Sutherland Timeline. It is just another
speed measuring device. Who says its the benchmark of rpm
measurement. The tachs we use at work cost 3x more than the
timeline and are sent out for calibration every 6 months. So
when it comes to accuracy I'll choose my device over the
Great review thorough and detailed. However, I was wondering what type of protractor did you use or would you recommend to set-up the arm?
Wilcan7, Graham provides a block that you place on your turntable spindle and then attach to the headshell of the tonearm and that is how you set the distance. Very easy to do especially with the TTW arm pod. You can place the pod anywhere you want and you will always have the correct distance for the tonearm. Graham also provides a fixture to align the cartridge. This thing is neat! You remove the wand and mount your cartridge. Then you place the wand in the fixture and set your stylus alignment. Very easy to do. Each fixture is made specific for each wand length, 12, 10 and 9 inch. The are not interchangeable. Each fixture is stamped with the wand length on it. Since I am using a 12 inch wand my fixture has a 12 stamped on it. It is very accurate. I have checked the alignment with the Feickert Protractor and it is dead on. The Feickert Universal Protractor would be my recommendation. It will work with any tonearm and cartridge combination. Nice tool.
Benjie, much thanks and congratulations on the new table! I did not order a Graham Arm with my V2 table. I'm using 2 Eliminators. Would you recommend that I upgrade to the Graham? Would that constitute a significant change? Moreover, I have been considering purchasing the Feickert Protractor. However, the best price I could find is $225. Please advise and thanks again.
Wilcan7, The Eliminator tonearm is a nice piece. You are getting a lot of performance for your money from that tonearm. I don't think that you will hear that much of a difference with the Graham. The Graham is a great sounding tonearm, well engineered and very easy to setup but I don't think it will be a significant change for you. The Graham will sound better but I don't think $5000 better.
As for the Feickert, $225 is a good price. You might be able to pick one up on Ebay, but they rarely come up for sale on the used market. Most people who buy it seem to keep it, I guess because it works so well with any tonearm and cartridge combination.
Benjie, Thanks much for your advice. I'll probably buy the Feickert at that price since you indicate its competitive.
I'm considering the Graham at its accompanying cost. My motivation is that an excellent table, such as the V2, should have a comparable tone arm. Thanks for your help. Still considering. I'll keep you posted. Thanks again!
Wilcan7, That is the same reason why I purchased the Graham tonearm. A world class turntable like the Momentus V2 deserves a world class tonearm like the Graham. There is not much, if anything out there on the audio market that will beat this combination.
Thanks for buying and reviewing this great Canadian table. Been considering a more basic model but so few reviews. They did not come to the Toronto AV show this year. I do use their excellent LP weight.
Notice you are also using a nice Canadian amp. How about speakers? Perhaps big Totems?
I agree with Benjie that you really do not need a timeline to check for speed deviations...
just use a real good piano recording and you will hear it right away if its wow-ing all over itself
Agree with sksos1, all show and no go.
Beauty is only skin deep.
Banerjba, my first TTW turntable was a GEM. Very nice turntable. I liked the sound, the quality and the craftsmanship of the turntable so much that I decided to move up to their Momentus turntable. The nice thing about TTW is that their cutting edge technology does get intergraded into the lower end of the line. Personally I think that the new Eliminator Copper turntable that TTW just released is a steal at that price. The new copper platter and the new drive controller turn this entry level turntable into a high end, world class performer. As I stated earlier, the nice thing about TTW turntables is the modular design. You can buy an entry level turntable and then as you budget allows upgrade the table to the newest technology. You are not stuck with buying a completely new turntable as you are with other manufactures. I really think that this is a big advantage for the consumer. It is a good thing to have options as your enjoyment of vinyl grows over the years.
Oh, speakers are B&W 801's.
If it takes 5 days to machine that copper platter they should farm it out to a machine shop that knows how to machine. All the parts in a automobile don't take 5 days to make......
Benjie, Thanks! I needed a rationale for spending the money. You convinced me to take the plunge. Much enjoyment with your new addition.
Nice system. I use B&W 704s. My room is a small main floor bedroom. I think the GEM and a Jelco 750 arm would be a good starting point. Really appreciate you comments.
Madranker, it is pretty obvious that you don't understand the process for machining this copper platter. You don't start out with a 110 lbs block of copper and make a precision platter in a few hours. If you understood how a 5 axis CNC machine worked, you would not make foolish statements like that. I am sure that any turntable manufacturers out there, that machines their own parts can appreciate the amount of time needed to produce a precision piece like this.
If you like cheap mass produced turntables, there are plenty of them to choose from.
And if you like poorly engineered turntables, there are plenty of them to choose from.
Amen to that brother. Good thing that TTW doesn't fall into that category.
I would disagree and say BOTH (yes I had 2 TTW tables) do fall into the bad camp.....but that's just my opinion.
Had a TTW. Pathetic. I smell a shill in this thread.
How do you know"... it will compete with 100,000 dollar turntables out there?"
Sksos1, I can respect your opinion but it sounds like you got a very early version of the TTW turntable when they just started out in business. Many things have changed since then and it has all been for the better. Just a general statement about turntables. Most people do not know how to properly set up a table. They think they do but they don't. I have been setting up tables for 40 years and know how to get the best performance from them. Like Lloyd Walker says the magic is in the details.
Kiddman, the shill you smell is yourself. You have been a member since 2001 and have never made a purchase on Audiogon. You have zero feedback. Every thread you post in is filled with negativity. You don't like anything, so why should we believe anything you have to say here.
Benjie I agree it's in the set-up that can make or break a table. I myself have been setting tables up for 35 plus years and do so for a living but the TTW table just had so many things wrong with them. And they had been in business for a number of yrs when I bought so you would have thought they knew what they were doing, it was not the case, at least for me but again YMMV.
I just recently purchased a Gem V2 back in November. I don't know about "timeline" measurements, but I do know what my ears tell me. This TT sounds phenomenal! Benjie is right about the detail and the soundstage it is absolutely incredible. It is one of the most dynamic TTs I've ever heard. Also it is dead quiet. You wouldn't think so from the way the motor couples to the platter, but it is machined so precisely, and the motor is such quality, that it works. If you want the benefits of a DD turntable this is really the only game in town. Let's face it, any TT's performance relies on a precision platter and bearing. Nobody out there can produce a more precise assembly than an aerospace machine shop. As to criticism regarding the motor and controller, I think that TTW probably has had problems in the past. Through research that I had made prior to this purchase, he has changed the motor at least once, and it seems the controller a couple of times in the last few years. IMO refinements in this product have resulted in a TT that is unmatched in the industry.
Another customer regarding the speed control that has been brought up in this forum, further proof our tables are deadly accurate and this is due to the rim drive technology that has been refined over more than 200 tables now in service.
Originally bought the GEM and then Upgraded to the MOMENTUS 40 KG CU9999 copper platter table.
Emailed Feb 25,2014.(He is not an Agon member, a new turntable customer)
I set-up the table to play. Before playing I followed your instruction
about fine tuning the speed.
I used a strobe and found that NO ADJUSTMENT was necessary. It was
EXACTLY 33 rpm. AMAZING!!
Played a reference disc "Night Fly" by Michael Fagan. The sound was amazing as well.
The table is AWESOME.............................. and it looks
Congratulations on creating such a fine instrument!
I love TTW, great and precise products, but ultimately I went with Expressimo Audio. It was a close call as I have bought many TTW tweaks, but Brian gives the best service you could ever ask for and I love the granite. I am buying 3 of his tonearms as soon as the production is available as we AB'ed his prototype to my VPI wands and I was blown away. You can't go wrong with either, but I would demo both if you are looking to get a serious turntable.
Well I got it. The TTW Momentus V2 Copper Turntable. It's everything you said it was and more. I have 3 other tables in my system and I can't seem to get the opportunity to play them. This thing is fantastic. However, I'm not writing to tell you what you already know. I have a question. I am assuming that you have a standard hook-up with your TTW. i.e. it is connected to the preamp, processor or integrated amp. I did something different. I connected the table to a 6 input mixer since the cadenzas have such low output. The mixer has an EQ and that allows me to amp up the output. Consequently, on the quiet passages I can hear the stylus moving through the grooves. Yes, it's grounded. I do have the option to a direct hook-up with the processor. I was wondering with your hook-up; how noiseless is the stylus on the quiet passages? What's you experience?
No hurry. Respond when you get the time.
Wilcan, congratulations on your new turntable. It is a unique piece of engineering! To answer your question, my table is dead silent during quiet passages. I do not hear any groove noise. I think I know what your problem is. I am using a Benz LPS cartridge with a Sutherland Hubble preamp. The recommended gain setting for the cartridge is 60 db. This cartridge also has a very low output 0.34mV. I tried different gain settings 62, 64, 66 and 68db. Each time I increased the gain setting the sound got worse and a increase in groove noise. At 68db the records sounded so bad you would not want to listen to them.
This is where I think your problem is. I believe all of the cadenzas line has an output between .5v to .3v, depending on which cartridge you have. I think that by using the mixer you are increasing the gain output for the cartridge way beyond the limits of the cartridge and that is the reason for the noise during quiet passages. There are very few cartridges that have a recommended gain setting above 60db. I think that you need to use a phono preamp that will allow you to adjust gain output and load range so that you get the best sound from your cartridge.
Here is another problem I see with using the mixer. How are you setting your Load Impedance for your cartridge? This is another critical setting. I think that using the mixer is really hurting the sound of your system. If it was me, I would invest in a nice phono stage.
Benjie, Thanks for your response and advice. I've been looking at phono preamps including yours. Although I like the Sutherland, I prefer a unit without batteries. I'm considering the following: Avid Pulsus, PS Audio Nu Wave Phono Converter, and the Parasound JC3. Do you have any suggestions? What do you think of these units? Please advise.
Wilcan I think the Avid Pulsus would be the best choice. I like the flexibility of the unit. The one thing most important is being able to tune your cartridge to get the best sound from it. I am sure you are finding out the the V2 Copper is a very revealing table and even very small changes in cartridge tracking force and VTA can make very big changes in the sound of your music.
I spent a few weeks trying different settings with my cartridge and tonearm and have come up with a combination that sound great with my V2 Copper table. The sound is amazing. Oh, one final note, I still have not had to adjust the platter speed, it is still rock steady at 33.33 rpm. As I said before, the Momentus V2 Copper is an fantastic piece of engineering!
LONG LIVE VINYL !!!!!
Benjie, Thanks for your response and advice. The avid is at the top of the list. I am looking at the Lehmann Decade as well. What do you think of this unit? ..........and you're RIGHT, the TTW Momentus V2 Copper TT is awesome. THANKS!
Wilcan, I still like the Avid Pulsus. I think it has a better build quality and is more versatile than the Lehmann.
I would give Sutherland another look. I am not sure if you know that they are a/c powered units now. I believe that they have gone away from battery power all together. They have updated their line and have a few different phono stages to choose from, something for every budget.
Thanks Benjie. I'll take another look at Sutherland. I do like the Pulsus. Now I have to scout around for a good deal.
Still working on the phono preamps. However, I wanted to bring another issue to your attention.
I was looking at the TTW sight and viewing the customer pictures. In doing so I came across a useful gadget for our table, i. e. a turntable brush. In the past I've used turntable brushes to clean the vinyl as it plays. However, the TTW Momentus V2 Copper Turntable is configured in such a way that no wand post is tall enough to be placed on the plinth so that it can connect with the brush wand.
While viewing the customer pictures, I came across a device that looks attractive as well as functional. To this end I draw your attention to photograph number 41 of 50 featuring the Con Amore by Korton.
Please take a look and tell me if you've seen this anywhere for purchase or if you know of a device that will fit our table.
Wilcan I have never seen that device. The only thing that I know of like that is the Keith Monks Record Sweeper. I am not sure if they even make the device anymore. From the pictures I have seen of the sweeper I do not think it would work anyway, the shaft looks to be too short.
What I do is, after the record is properly cleaned, when I am going to play the record I use a DAK Carbon fiber brush to remove any dust or static that may be on the record. By doing this the record is static free and less likely to attract dust while playing. When the record is finish playing, the stylus is clean, no fuzz, dust or dirt.
Benjie: I contacted the manufacturer of the turntable displaying the device. They failed to respond to date. I hope TTW develops the device. It would probably be even better.