Trying vinyl, need some help!


For the last month, I have been searching for a good cd player or transport and thought I had settled on a Mcintosh unit when I started looking and turntables. I found a Roksan Radius 5 with a Nima tonearm that was in my budget so I bought it.
Now comes the problem, the cartridge. There are so many to choose from and they are not cheap so finding one that would compliment the table/arm is a bit intimidating.
My Audio Research preamp has 2 inputs for MM, or I can purchase a dedicated MC preamp.
If anyone has any experience with the Radius 5 please let me know what you have tried.
drf24

Showing 6 responses by chakster

Why not just stay with MM phono stage, but upgraded it to 100k Ohm with Vishay naked Foil Resistors? You can use some of the best MM cartridge with your phono stage without any needs for an MC and MC phono stage. Loaded your MM cartridge with 100k Ohm you will get an amazing sound quality compared to standard 47k Ohm. The cost of this upgrade is nothing. Those resistors available from Texas Components (USA) on ebay. This is the best resistors for audio available today. Highly recommended! 

BTW with your budget you can buy some killer MM from the 70s/80s era, something like AT20SLa or Grace F9
@drf24 you can pay less to get much better quality if you will look for MM/MI cartridges made on peak of the MM boom (in the 70s). This is one of them with nude Shibata stylus tip.

Yes, the 100k Ohm option will open up the potential of almost any MM/MI cartridge, simply locate 47k Ohm resistors inside your phono stage and replace them with Vishay 100k Ohm resistors, it will take 15 minutes. Thanks to Raul and Lewm for this advice. 

There you go (you need two, select 100k ohm value): https://www.ebay.com/itm/Texas-Components-TX2575-Naked-Foil-Audio-Resistor-at-0-1-or-better-TX2352-v... 

@glennewdick

Most MM manufactures build for 47k ohms you would get more out of the MM cart by having selectable capacitance. MC you want selectable resistance (or as we say loading it).

This is not true, nearly ALL top quality MM cartridges are made for 47-100k Ohm preamps and this stated in the manuals for all the best cartridges made by Grace, Victor, Audio-Technica etc. If you don’t know this plz just search online. Nowadays nobody cares about MM cartridges that much like it was the the 70s/80s.

I have had one of the best Dynavector (high output) and Audio-Technica MC ART-2000 wich is much better than OC9. They are good cartridges, but all of them must be re-tipped and that’s not cheap. All those LOMC require an expensive MC preamp or an expensive SUT. High output MC are sensitive to loading. This is all too complicated and much more expensive than a decent MM cartridge!

And as i said when you change 47k resistors to 100k resistors none of those MC will sound any better than MM cartridge. Instead of spending $500-1000 for a SUT or to pay extra for MC preamp, anyone can spend $36 for Vishay Naked Foil 100k resistors first.

Instead of paying $500 for retip anyone can use replacement stylus for MM cartridges for less with the most advanced cantilevers (beryllium) and diamonds like Shibata. Styli for the AT20SLa still available.

Also your MC cartridges are mid compliance, while the AT20SLa is a high compliance cartridge with much better tracking ability.

The MM cartridge is the FIRST THING to try if the budget is limited and also must have for anyone who still believe that more expensive MC is superior. It will be not easy to find a multi thousands MC cartridge to beat reasonably priced MM carts like Audio-Technica AT-ML170, Grace F14, Pioneer PC-1000 mk2, Glanz MFG-61, Victor X-1 or X-1II ... just to name a few. And the prices for all of them are $600-1500 even if they are NOS in the boxes. Garott Brothers still makes great MM cartridges, i believe SoundSmith MI cartridges are also very good for those who would like to avoid any used cartridges.

It’s easy to ignore all that SUT game and LOMC stuff, additional cables, very expensive high gain phono preamps etc. The high output MC are inferior to the LOMC in most cases.

So what is the reason you’re recommending an average MC cartridge to a person with $600 budget? And why not to upgrade the phono stage if it cost just $36 for the best audio resistors ever made and 15 minutes of soldering time?

There is a lecture of Peter Ledermann of the SoundSmith online, he could explain better why MC should be avoided, he’s the one who repaired many thousands of them. https://youtu.be/F65mODzn4Gk

I don’t understand all that hype about LOMC cartridges even with my own experience with some of the "very good" LOMC such as Zyx Airy, Zyx Premium 4D, Ortofon MC2000, Fidelity-Research FR-7f, PMC-3 ... and various HOMC cartridges.

It’s much easier to make your MM cartridge sounds great first (and it is sounds great) before investing serious cash for LOMC, then it’s easy to be dissapointed about the whole myth of LOMC, compared to some nice vintage MM and MI.


@brianmoriarty 
Have you seen this video about Grado Labs https://youtu.be/L2ZpJHGYMC8 ? Very interesting. 

One of the best Grado MI i have ever heard is Joseph Grado signature XTZ model from the 80s, the price was $750 back in the days. I've managed to find NOS sample in the original box. This is a very special cartridge from Joseph Grado himself (RIP).  
@drf24

I know this isnt always true in practice but I guess the only way to find out is to buy a MC and MM at the same price point and see which one I enjoy more.

The key is not the price point, but a quality of the cartridge, MM is always cheaper. Top quality MM at $700 (used) can beat $3000 MC with ease.

@roberjerman

MC cartridges beat MM and MI cartridges for sound quality and information retrieval from those vinyl grooves - contrary to what the untutored say! My experience goes back 40 years! Limited budget? Try the Denon 103R

Do yourself a favor, listen to Mr. Peter Ledermann’s (SoundSmith) speach about MI vs. MC in this video https://youtu.be/F65mODzn4Gk He’s the guy who refurbishing your MC cartridges every day for ages. If that’s not enouph read this thread and you will discover amazing MM/MI cartridges https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/who-needs-a-mm-cartridge-type-when-we-have-mc Another great article about how close is the MM to the master tape is here: http://www.regonaudio.com/Stanton881AudioTechnicaATML70.html
MC cartridges are not bad, just 3 times more expensive when it comes to a good ones (if they are used) and 10 times more expensive if they are brand new + the cost of the SUT or high gain phono stage (even for your cheap Denon 103). 

No, your cheap DENON-DL103R MC does not extract the information from the vinyl groove, because it has an awful conical stylus tip, more about styli here: https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_forum/viewtopic.php?t=22894 The truth is truth, even if you’re a beliver. This is just an entry level MC cartridge, designed in the 60s to play records on NHK Radiostation in Japan.