to buy or not to buy (ultrasonic record cleaner)

You know I will ;)

Oh and I forgot to mention that both pics were taken of the exact same spot on the record. 

@mglik 

Micheal Fremer did a review of this type machine on YouTube. It was rather impressive. Thanks for the info. 

Mammonthguy54. 
Funny how that music sounds better in dim lighting. Just like things sound louder at night overall. Maybe record cleaners clean better at night too! Just saying 

@spypunk. 
LMBO. 

@tablejockey 
do you use Tergikleen in your spin clean? If you don’t you should try it. I may also stat using a very small amount of 70% alcohol. The Tergikleen works very well tho. 

Well the jury is still out for me on the US machine. I think maybe I need to find a dirty record of which I have none to actually see what this think will do. So maybe both my cleaning test and listing test is skewed from the perspective of I’m cleaning clean records or relatively clean anyway. Might go to the record store and find a dirty record. Just a little reluctant to test it with my cartridge just to prove a point. 

I cleaned it first with my system then cleaned it with the ultrasonic. Unfortunately with my system I can’t clean only one side nor with the ultrasonic but my thinking was if the ultrasonic was so much better I wanted to see a major difference after using it. Truthfully I cannot. 

Ok. Here is the thing that I think makes a difference. With the ultrasonic you use a boars hair brush and surfactant which I did use when I I did the cleaning. I am betting that if I incorporate that into my systems cleaning routine the grooves will be about as clean, but your right. Test 2 is the ultrasonic cleaner. However if there is a difference I don’t know if I could justify spending the coin for the ultrasonic. 
Furthermore. The listening test proved to be in inclusive as I heard no sonic difference between cleanings. If it was I certainly could not detect it. Also the downside. The process takes way away longer using the machine. I could clean 10 records by the time it takes me to clean one using the machine. Ok I’m getting a little bias now because that should not matter but I have over 400 albums and it will take me a year to clean them all with the ultrasonic. I guess if I were buying old dusty records maybe but I only buy new or used in mint condition. I guess for the one offs where I run across an original pressing of an old record I will just borrow the machine again lol. Now I will tell you that this machine is not one of the more expensive ones. (Under $2k) so I’m not comparing this to one of the more top of the line cleaners either. 

All good points

@oranfoster 
thanks foe the kind words 

@tablejockey 
I hear you. However I would suggest going to 70% alcohol and not 99%. Other than that not a bad formula. 

Everyone has made some good arguments and thanks. This tread was my first attempt at dipping my toe in the pool of US record cleaners. As with most things I’m researching when deciding to purchase a new “thing” to buy to take my audio listening to the next level or make an improvement in my system is to first gauge the audio listening community on how they feel about the topic or item. With that said up until now I have not done much reading on the  science behind these products or the pros and cons.  I had an opportunity to try one out because a friend of mine bought one and he was kind enough to let me borrow it for a few days to see if I liked it. My first test while a little crude was to compare the US cleaner vs the process I currently use was inconclusive. The record I chose to use in this test I think represents a good cross section of all the records in my library (near mint to new). From a superficial visual perspective both methods appear about the same but that was to be expected. Going a step further and comparing both methods using a microscope was very close between the two to  about identical as you can see from the photos. Granted I don’t have a microscope that can actually get into the grooves to see at the micron level but hey I’m not a scientist that has access to that type equipment, but I used what I have.   Now the listening test which I can count on was identical. I hear NO difference between cleanings of this record. Now I have to admit that I can’t remember every little snap or crackle when listing to a record two times back to back with an hour between listening and also if a dust particle would fall in the record during one session that would contaminate the sample. However not really trying to be that critical either, but overall the sound quality was the same to me. Prob not a fair assessment because after all it was one record out of over the 400 I own. So. Since yesterday I have done some reading and I am learning that there are other factors to consider with these machines when deciding to buy one. There are a ton of them on the market ranging in price from $200 -$10k and even higher. All boasting this or that. Some are a one stop shop, others like the one I’m using requires a lengthy cleaning process. Also there is the safety considerations. Some of these machines heat the water, some just get hot because they have ceramic materials which heat that can lead to warping. Some you have to be careful of the frequency used for the cleaning or you can damage a record. Going to tell you right now that is not an option for me. I own some very expensive copies of  records that would really wreck my day if  damaged in a cleaning because the machine malfunction or got to hot. There are chemicals to buy and thats a whole different conversation with just as many options to choose. Lots of things to consider I’m finding out. Anyway. Thanks again for all the replies. I have to admit I was expecting to hear some comments from people who have negative things to say about US cleaners but not so much in this case. Might be the first time that most people agree on a topic involving this hobby lol. Usually it’s a pretty evenly divided conversation for those for and against. So I guess that is a positive in the column of seriously considering one. So I will continue to do my research and make a decision. 

@mammothguy54 

Thanks. I appreciate that. 
I have heard people on this thread mentioning the degritter.  Not at all familiar. I will indeed take a closer look at that and that’s for the suggestion. 
-Keith

@mammothguy54 

not to get in your business but what table and cartridge are you using?

Decision made.
So after reading up more on US RCMs (see I even have the acronyms down now) I have decided to go with the degritter.

The link Mammothguy54 Provided answers to my questions and put my mind at ease in regards to the machine causing damage to my vinyl. The machine manages the water temp, the transport system was highly touted by the reviewer and nothing is pressing against the record when inserting in the slot. I even cringe when sliding my records between the felt brushes on my spin clean. The review also goes into detail as to why degritter chose to use 120 Hz frequency as the best and safest to use in vinyl cleaning (I’m sure that is debatable but I like what I read). It seems that the degritter was designed with vinyl record cleaning in mind as opposed to adapting a machine meant for multiple purposes to cleaning records. I like the fact that it’s software driven and allows for future updates. Many of the features I would want in a RCM are packaged in the degritter. I won’t go into all of them here but the link is a couple post above and if you are looking to buy one of these machines and are on the fence it’s a worthwhile read. Oh and the price is right. $3k is a lot of money but from what I have read it’s about mid point price for these devices and if it does as good a job as anticipated its worth it to me. Will it make a difference in sound quality? I guess we will find out. If this thing does as good a job as the review implies it would almost have to. Also there is a retailer in my local area which is a plus. I like to do business with a smile and a handshake. Life is all about relationships.
I plan to pick one up this week. I will report back on my experience.
Please excuse any typos as this was written in my cell.

Correction on the cavitation frequency of the Degritter. I meant to say it operates at 120 kHz. Not 120 Hz. Big difference. 

@tablejockey 

There is a place here in Atlanta that retails them. Going to call tomorrow. Hopefully they have a demo I can check it. 

Called and spoke to the local dealer about the Degritter. I have an appt for Friday morning to go and see a demo. He has to order it because the last one in stock was sold last week. Few weeks lead time to get one but that’s ok. No hurry. I will let you guys know how I like it. 

@mammothguy54 

So you just purchased your degritter? Sounds like you have found the secret sauce. Now you have me really anticipating seeing this thing in action and hearing for myself. I have tried but cannot find anyone who has a bad thing to say about it. That in itself is pretty impressive. The salesman at the store spoke highly of it for sure. Said he can’t keep them in stock. That usually would go in one ear and out the other because what else would he say right.. however everything I have read about it is positive so his comments were right in line what people like you who own it are saying. Seems like there is no ambiguity in what folks are saying either. I am a firm believer and have always known the importance of record cleaning and if this works like everyone says it does I will be over the mountain happy. Honestly I hate cleaning records. I’m not a very patient person, but I do it.  So if this will add a little fun to the task and actually do the job I’m all in. My dilemma was spending the money on something that I could achieve the same result with a manual process. Also there are a lot of machines like the one I borrowed where you spend the money and then still have a very time consuming manual component to get the right result. The salesman says this is basically drop the record in and your done. I’m sure mileage may vary depending on how dirty the record actually is but that record I would hope to never buy in the first place 😂. Keep me posted on your experience as it will be a few weeks before I actually get it delivered since it has to be ordered. One question. How loud is it during operation? Can you speak to that? 

@mammothguy54 

nice. Yeah I considered the Delos but opted for the Kleos instead. Can’t go wrong with Lyra. Nicely done. 
I agree on your cleaning method however once deep cleaned I should be fine to forego the vacuum. However I do agree doing both with a used record and the first cleaning. So just to be clear when I talk about record cleaning mainly my considerations are the second cleaning onwards. 
The machine like yours will be setup in a separate room than the listening room. Usually I clean on one day and listen another. Unless I’m streaming, or listening to reel. Yeah I’m still a reel to reel guy. Always have been. Always will be. Not a lot of us still in captivity lol. 

You know how it is with this hobby. Everything is expensive. It’s all relative tho. You have to consider your larger investment, cartridge stylus, record collection, etc. so yeah while not cheap neither is anything else in this hobby. Price of being a vinyl collector I guess. 

@whart 

Thanks. Will curl it out. 

@whart 

you should try it. It was $16 plush $15 shipping lol. My wife pretty much has the same brush (boars hair) that she paid $10 for locally. She never used it and I begged her for it and it also did a good job However like I said I think the shorter handle on the Kirmuss brush was more controllable for moving the brush in a circular pattern with less hand fatigue simply because of how your able to hold it. 

So just to report back. I pulled the trigger on the degritter today. It’s on order so should have it soon. After all the research I have done this machine seems to offer what I am looking for. The price was a little over budget for this  purchase however I feel in the long run it is worth the money. Thanks for all the input guys it definitely helped to guide my decision. Looking forward to doing some cleaning and spinning. Happy listening