Time to choose: Baerwald, Lofgren, Stevenson ?

@nandric

Stevenson wanted ’’optimal values’’ near the spindle with assumption that the grooves end is about 6 cm distance from the spindle. To put it otherwise he thought that the ’’inner grooves’’ are the most problematic for the (conventional) tonearms. The Japanese tonearm designers, among which also Ikeda, somehow prefered this geometry.

Thant’s the point, theoretically Stevenson’s geometry is better for 7’inch records (45s). In this case we don’t need optimal geometry for the whole radius of 12’inch, because the 45s (vinyl singles) are much smaller, there is only one track per side. That’s the same 45 rpm (7’inch) on my platter.

It make sence to use Stevenson with this format of the vinyl.

Since the RCA Victor invetned mono 45s in 1949 they soon became the most popular format (in stereo) of the industry for radio disc-jokeys in the 60s & 70s. As far as i know analog radio broadcast equimpement were on very high level in Japan (NHK), Europe and the USA in the 60s and 70s period (supplied by the top manufacturers like denon, technics, emt ..).

I wonder when Stevenson invented his alignment (before 1949 or after) ?

@nandric

So I never owned those 7’’ kinds. Are those also called ’’records’’?

Haha. Believe it or not, but many bands from the 50s, 60s, 70s never released a full albums, just one or two singles on independens labels in 7’inch format (often just 500 copies) and then they are gone, so many fortotten gems in all genres of music. That’s why they are highly collectable, i’m talking about originals of course. Even if the band got an LP album the 45 single version can be different (take or arrangement). Pressing of the 45 (7inch) release is also cheaper than LP or "12.

I know that most audiophiles ignoring this format and i can understand why, but for collectors those 45s are holy grails. Some of them recorded very well btw, some comes with mono and stereo versions of the same track on different side of the record (easy to comare).

As for the Stevenson’s alignment i’m not sure, it’s just my suggestion, i think there must be industry standard (special alignment) for small record.

But my original question is abut users experience with those arms adjusted by Baerwald, Lofgren, Stevenson.

Hi Raul, i’m gonna experiment with different alignment and different cartridges since the reconstruction of my new room is finished, finally. All set-up is ready to use and i’m looking forward to test everything.

Now about alignment for everybody:

Baerwald and Lofgren made their fundamental publications in the first half of 20th century. Later in the early 60s Stevenson (another mathematician) has calculated a new set of parameters taking into account that on records with classical music very often crescendos occur towards the innermost grooves! That make sence.

The key word for Stevenson is "crescendo" which is a passage played with a gradual increase in volume or intensity (in classical music). According to Stevenson's alignment method a new set of parameters taking into account that on records with classical music very often crescendos occur towards the innermost grooves. 

It's about arrangment of the classical music and where is the most complicated grooves located on the record surface (beggining, middle or toward the end on the record). It can be true if we are listening to a long (17 min for example) classical music track on 12'inch or 10'inch (or even a short 3 min track on 7'inch record). 

A crescendo is a way for composers to indicate that a passage of music should gradually increase in loudness over time (opposite of a decrease in volume which is described as a 'decrescendo'). It is also used in non-musical context to describe any situation in which volume is increasing.

BTW the most complicated grooves with cannon shots on Telarc 1812 Overture located in the end of the LP. 

@thom_mackris

I view this in the same way that I view people who don’t play half of their records because they don’t sound good.

With this point of view It seems like you are ignoring all formats of the vinyl records, except the "12 inch format. I don’t play half of the record simply because "7 inch single is nearly two times smaller in size than "12 inch and there is only 1 track per side recorded on 45rpm on the 7 inch records. Why do i need Baervald/Lofgren null points outside of the surface of my vinyl when we have Stevenson?

I’m not into classical music at all, i prefer black music from the 60s and 70s (Jazz, Soul) on original pressings, but the logic of stevenson works great for small format of the vinyl singles (aka 45s) in any genre of music.

@thom_mackris

I’ve tried Stevenson for victor ua-7045 on luxman pd444 and it sounds great (no matter LPs or 45s). First cartridge was AT-ML170 OFC mounted at AT technihard shell (at-lh13). The little twist is hardly visible, but i’ve done so to set it up in dead accuracy by Dr.Feickert.

Now i have Victor X1 with Grace HS-6 headshell on the same arm. I use Baerwald, but i sill have to twist the cartridge in headshell even more.

I think Victor UA-7045 was designed with Stevenson alignment in mind, correct me if i’m wrond.

My Reed 3p was designed with Baerwald alignment in mind and this is what i use with Feickert. With Pioneer PC-1000 mk2 the sound is fantastic. I love this cartridge even more now.

Long before i get Dr.Feickert i used protractor from Hi-Fi News Analogue Test LP (they call it Linear Offset technique.) It’s Baerwald and works fine for "12 inch tonearms, there are no errors when i use both now to doubleckeck the accuracy of the old one compared to new.

It's amazing how far we can go with audiogon contributors, from old '7 inch records to the new '7 inch tonearms. 

Well, i'm testing Lofgren alignment with good results on Victor UA-7045 with Victor X1 cartridge. 

What is truly amazing with Victor X1 is my new 100k ohm resistors that completely change the sound of this cartridge. Hard to believe i'm listening to the same phono stage and the same cart i used before at 47k ohms. 

@lewm 

Chakster, You might consider listening to the Victor tonearm in Lofgren for several weeks. Then re-align for Stevenson (only assuming that the Victor UA7045 is designed for Stevenson), and listen for another few weeks. Then decide which you prefer. A few hours of listening to one alignment is not going to provide sufficient information, in my opinion.

That's what i'm gonna do. I think i'm very well prepared for a long winter, it's start snowing and getting below zero degree. I will spend more time listening good music in the late evenings (using different carts and arms). That's the the plan. 

@fleib

Chakster,

I bet you’ll wind up with Loefgren alignment. Both nulls are within the recorded part of a 7". Error will be much less through most of song. Stevenson will be better at the end, but much worse up until there.

No, only one null point is on the recorded part of the 7" inch. As you know Feickert use 3 steps: 1) for overhang. 2) for offset at outer null point. 3) for offset at inner null point.

Only Stevenson’s geometry is withing the 7" inch two times: First at step-1 (aka overhang), which is exactly the beggining of the recorded grooves (aka the beggining of the track, not the edge of the vinyl) on 7" inch, and step-3 (aka offset) on the inner null point which is exactly in the end of recorded music (not the edge of the label) on 7" inch vinyl. While the Baerwald and Lofgren are on the 7" inch ONLY at inner null point once.

@rauliruegas 

the MINT LP one, that's a dedicated protractor for the TT/tonearm we own. It's really accurated and for only 100.00-150.00.

Or Dr.Feickert analog protractor (next generation) just for £137 new from analogue seduction in UK. The pound is weak and now it's just about $170 including shipping outside Europe. Superb build quality! 

@fleib Feickert’s step-1 of the Stevenson’s point for overhang is exactly the beggining of the groove on 7’inch vinyl. That’s what i meant. The null points are on the left and right, and only inner null (by Stevenson), which is step-3 by Feickert, located in the end of the musical information (groove) of the 7’inch vinyl.

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