This cable game is making my head spin


Hello all

I'll start by listing my system for reference.

Pioneer PLX-1000 turntable w/ Ortofon 2M Black cart.

Tokyo Sound Phono stage (A late 90's Japanese Audio company)

Aric Audio Unlimited all tube preamp

Odyssey Khartago w/ upgraded power supply and internal wiring

Divine Acoustics Proxima speakers

Now the story of my Frankenstein cable setup.  When I started purchasing cables I found an independent cable maker online who used silver in all his cables. I had purchased 3 power cables for my phono pre, preamp and amp. Unfortunately we had a falling out and I decided not to purchase any more cables from him. I was very green in the whole cable game and I still am but have learned a bit since. Most notably is how silver can brighten a system and the Ortofon 2M black is known as a bright sounding cart to begin with.

Being on a budget and wanting to upgrade all my interconnects at once I came upon vintage western electric interconnects being sold on here and elsewhere. Purported "giant killers" so I bought those for the time being at $114 a pair. But I needed a phono cable and being as green as I am/was thought you needed a cable with an attached ground and extra shielding. I couldn't find a western electric specific phono cable so I bought an Audio Sensibility impact SE phono cable. For speaker wire I went with the Belden 9497 from the same place I got the western electric. A nice budget cable and also a purported "giant killer". For my turntable I  got a western electric power cable from the same place.

So I'm running 3 silver power cables to phono amp, preamp, amp and a western electric power cable to the turntable. Audio Sensibility phono cable. Western Electric interconnects from phono to preamp and preamp to amp, and the Belden 9497 speaker wire. What a mess right lol.

I want to streamline all my cables so I bought a pair of Audio Sensibility impact se interconnects. Same make as my phono cable. When I put them in between the preamp and amp I was shocked how dull and lifeless the sound was. Granted they are not broken in and only went through the 3 day burn in process Audio Sensibility offers but I was not expecting that dramatic of a change. The phono cable sounds good so maybe it is break in? Or the phono cable being OCC copper is taming some of the harshness of the Ortofon cartridge but the interconnect from preamp to amo is taming it too much?

I'd like to start auditioning cables from different manufacturers in the "mid-fi" price range and actually get this done right this time around. Given my system is there any advice to be offered on where I should start? I don't want things too bright sounding but not as lifeless as the Audio Sensibility (occ copper) either. And I'm a sucker for lush mid bass and mids hence the all tube preamp.

Sorry for the novel and thanks for any help!

 

128x128blue_collar_audio_guy

Showing 9 responses by blue_collar_audio_guy

Not challenging your experience, however its a little perplexing to read a cable with OCC copper is dull, lifeless, or taming too much.

Is it possible I'm just so used to how bright my system is that a more neutral cable would lead me to think of it as dull? I have a cd player I can try them out on to see what that sounds like. Thanks. 

I'll also look into the cardas cables like ghdprentice suggested. 

Silver is not a good metal choice for power cables. Use 14ga. or larger copper power cables.

 

Thanks I'll keep that in mind! 

 

 

 

 

Turns out, it was the room.

Have you eliminated your room as a factor?

I have some basic acoustic foam corner bass traps and a small amount of acoustic foam on the ceiling above the main listening position. They tightened the low end up a bit not much but better with than without. 

 

THIS step is where you noted the drastic change, correct?

Correct.

 

Thanks for the suggestions guys I’m checking them out. I do have an Audio Sensibility Impact SE power cable I could try with the amplifier but is it important if its high current? Technically I’m half way there if I want to go the audio sensibility route which is my conundrum now. Abandon ship and start building a loom of another make or stick it out with Audio sensibility? As for the silver debate and the miles of copper debate I’m not getting involved LOL! I may be green but I know about that drama. 😂 Just playing guys. I appreciate the responses. This cabling is becoming more fun if that’s possible.

Do you have any isolation feet or vibration control devices under any of your components? Remove them and see if the sound changes. Some of these devices kill dynamics and make your system sound just like you described.

I have my amp, preamp, and phono stage on thick butcher block platforms with spikes. If I were to experiment running without should I try removing one at a time?

 

I did some experimenting today and ran the Impact SE power cable to my amplifier. I liked what was I hearing so far. Need to break in to further evaluate. I also tried the Impact SE interconnect in different configurations with a digital source and vinyl and found I like it best running from Phono stage to preamp. I’ve read speaker cables are your most important cable investment. Is this true? I would put more in budget towards them if that is the case. $1000-1500 for a pair of life long cables. Have looked at Silversmith Fildeliums and Supra Sword among the other brands that have been suggestion here like the Cardas, Wireworld, etc..

An update on the situation. I've decided to stick with audio sensibility as I only need one short pair of interconnects and two power cables to complete a full loom. I can then use this as a baseline for any further upgrades. 

As for speaker cables for the time being before deciding if I want to go really big in the future I got a pair of raven audio soniquil cables. Banana plug connectors. Now I can't tell if its the fact that they were replacing dollar a foot classic Belden 9497 speaker cables or that they are just that good but damn I was heartily impressed at $184 for a 6ft pair. Immediate opening up of sound and have gotten better over time now. Not sure if going big on speaker cables is as much of a top priority now lol!

Oh one additional thing I did that had a dramatic improvement was replace the 1980s withered wall receptacle with an orange outlet from home depot. It even said recommended for computer and audio applications on the package which gave me a good chuckle. $9.95 but low and behold there was a noticeable difference. Before there was a slight audible hum within 3 inches of the speaker when everything was turned. I had assumed that was just a casualty of running the all tube preamp and was fine with it as at my listening level its not an issue at all. With the orange outlet now though it is dead quiet. You have to practically dig your ear down into the speaker to hear anything. Not sure if this means lowering the noise floor or something but it sounds better to me so all good!

Perhaps I wasn’t clear enough. I’m using the audio sensibilty impact se their lowest model. That would make all my cables that model. Giving me a baseline. 

After much time switching all my power cables around I have found a combination I can live with. The two silver cables are running the turntable and phono preamp. The Audio Sensibility impact copper cable is on the preamp and the vintage western electric tinned copper cable is on the amplifier.  I havn't bought any additional cables yet but I'm getting curious now what getting the silver cables out of my system and replacing with copper will do to the sound. I like the resolution of silver but feel it's still a tad bit harsh sounding and thin on the midbass. I think its time to start the cable co. lending program and demo some of the cable manufacturers suggested here starting with Cardas. 

Thats a negative. Putting the silver cords anywhere in the preamp, amp or both brings out way to much harshness for my liking. Bob Dylan's harmonica becomes ear screeching for example. 

@lak They are custom made by Mark Tunis he sells on audiogon. I've had them for around 4 years so they are fully burned in.