Tekton Design Moab


Ordered a pair just now. In Dark Gray, to which Tammy immediately said, "Oh the Charcoal is beautiful!" Charcoal sounds better than Dark Gray (even though we are talking about the same color!) so Charcoal it is!  

My beloved Talon Khorus do still sound awfully good. It will be interesting to see how the Moabs stock out of the box compare with these tweaked and modded warhorses. Both the strength, and the weakness, of the Khorus is using the 10" woofer to cover so much midrange. Its a strength because it makes for a very smooth and cohesive sound. But its a weakness because its asking a lot of such a large driver to go so high. Talon makes up for it with their isobaric design. Mounted inside and directly behind the woofer is another identical driver facing the opposite direction. The idea is this relieves the front facing driver of having to compress the air inside the cabinet. This does allow for a much faster response, and is a big reason for the wonderful music the Khorus produces. 

I have a feeling however it is no match for Eric Alexander's ultra-low mass driver array solution. Only one way to know for sure. So we will just have to see!  

 https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/8367 
128x128millercarbon

Showing 50 responses by millercarbon

Oh, I've been listening, and thoroughly enjoying, the best sound I have ever heard, anywhere. Truly. Not even that close. For a long time, many months, I've been doing one thing after another with never really enough time for everything to completely settle in. Its strange, for sure a lot of guys don't believe it, but its not just the major components a lot of things get better over time just being left playing music undisturbed. Mine finally got that the last several weeks and its pretty sweet.  

Moab break-in is pretty short and sweet. Basically they sound great and I was enjoying mine right out of the box. They did improve of course but were pretty stable after only about 50 hours. If you hunt around the Tekton site there's an old thread where Eric says the same thing- full break-in is about 50 hours but if they don't sound great right out of the box send em back. Nobody sends em back.

Bi-wire and bi-amp you are paying for extra Cardas speaker binding posts. No way I would ever do either but for some reason some guys want the option and so he offers it. The $500 upgrade I got was the better Cardas binding posts, better crossover components, and mil-spec (whatever that means) internal wiring. I've been inside and can tell you the parts quality is quite high.

There's two Be upgrades. The cheap one is just the one tweeter. The expensive one is the tweeter and all 14 of the midrange drivers are Be. That's 15 Be drivers. At the time it was hard to believe how good the Moabs would be, and easy to assume the Be upgrade couldn't possibly be worth it. Now having lived with these a while its a lot easier to believe Eric when he says all-Be Moabs will go up against everything at every price. So yes it is an expensive upgrade, but you are then getting six-figure speakers.  

There's a clue there to keep in mind. Just his normal everyday Moabs are so good its hard to believe until you get them. The comments you hear from Eric and others are, if anything, understated. These are truly remarkable speakers. To try and tell someone how good they are, well you see all the hateful reactions it generates from some people. Now imagine trying to say oh and with Be tweeters now its as good as anything from Magico, Wilson, etc, at any price. Total trigger warning, brain vessels bursting, H18 going overdrive. This probably explains why even with all my questions about upgrades Eric never really pushed all-Be drivers to me at all. But then after I had them and was talking to him one day about how awesome they are he lowered his voice and sort of conspiratorially offered that with all-Be it is a match for anything out there.  

Never would have believed it before. No problem believing it now. If its something you can afford- go for it.

The speakers are big and the boxes are huge but I had no trouble bringing them in and unboxing them all by myself. Old Dominion will bring them to your door but not set foot inside your house. One box was (very) slightly damaged, the delivery guy was happy to wait and let me open and inspect while he was there. About the only thing worth mentioning here is it helps to have a high ceiling! Tried doing one in my 9ft high listening room, had to go back to the vaulted ceiling living room. (You could do it with a lower ceiling, but would need to either lay it down or tilt it, and I would suggest an extra set of hands for that.)

Packaging is cardboard not crates, which makes everything a lot easier. (I've had crates- no thanks!)

With questions your best bet is to just call and ask. If you get Eric he's always busy but usually impressively willing to talk as long as you don't mind being interrupted by work going on. If you get Tammy she can answer most questions, and has more time, so try and use her for general info and save Eric for the more technical stuff.

How close are you to ordering?

Its not dead, but I almost was. Nine days in hospital, multi-focal pneumonia bad enough they nearly had me on a vent. Kind of lost interest in the blather. Not the news, like your sub experience. But the blather. Which unfortunately the only thing seems capable of getting the blatherers to move along please is to leave them to their own devices. Sad. But true.

Not the least bit surprised to hear even an equalized sub can't match the 4-10. All of us who know DBA knew this would be the case. The multiple large woofers was one of the clues telling me Moabs would indeed have excellent bass. Just like everyone said.  

The bass is even better now. They are still on the MDF Spring Thing because I've been way too exhausted to work in the shop. The new improved and totally redesigned Spring Thing will have to wait a few more weeks. But I got some more from Nobsound and so now have nearly my whole system suspended.  

The last 2 subs went on Nobsound, and so now all 5 subs are on springs. The amp, phono stage, turntable, and now even the conditioner are on springs. The Moabs, of course. Only the Verus Controller and the sub amps are not on springs. Also, almost all the cables are suspended on rubber bands. Only the phono leads and a few bits of wire here and there remain to be suspended. 

Oh, and the crossovers! Elastic suspension works so well everywhere else that it ought to work wonders there. Especially since the Moab crossovers are mounted on an internal brace directly behind the lower woofer. The crossover mounting board looks to be MDF and glued to the brace. Its quite thin so will need to be careful removing it. A couple leftover Nobsound springs ought to be about right. Probably help to add a little mass, and I do have two small BDR Shelf pieces that might be just about perfect for the job. 

When I can find the time. And the energy. 

Until then would sure be nice to hear only from people like you with something to contribute. All the rest can pretend its dead, move along please, and let it RIP.
I was at one point on 10 liters 02, which is a lot of oxygen, and even at that out of breath and feeling like I was about 10 feet underwater. That's just lying there. Just to roll over, adjust blankets, was an effort it took a while to recover from. How close I was to being on a vent, I don't want to know. Too close for comfort. 

Its no secret I was originally settled on Ulfs. Only at the last minute I let teajay talk me out of them and into Moabs. No regrets. But his point was the only difference between them is the tiny little bass range covered by the extra Ulf woofers. This for sure is wrong. All the drivers in the Ulf are better quality. I'm sure if you dig into it with Eric you will learn there's better crossover and other parts upgrades as well. Eric always says all his speakers sound the same, they just get more refined as you move up the line. A lot of guys talk the talk of refined, but then when it comes to it they buy coarse ground.

No regrets though because the difference in price is what will get me a Raven amp a lot sooner- and that will for sure be a big step up in refinement. My point is to talk to Eric about it. Now being an experienced owner you'll be in a much better position to figure it out. Its hard before living with Moabs to believe anything could actually be this good, let alone a lot better.

Two big questions I would have for him: All-Be Moabs or Ulfs? And, what about the new statement speakers?

Impression I got last we talked was all-Be Moabs is the killer setup. Not that all-Be Ulfs wouldn't be even better still. Which now you are in a good position to ask him about.

The statement speaker, find out what you can. All I know is he's working on something really groundbreaking. Like now he's made phenomenally good reasonably priced speakers, the next step is ones that go more directly at the cost no object SOTA boutique speakers - and beat them all. He already feels something like his all-Be Moab or Ulf are there, but wants something equally good in looks and build. So they will cost a lot more. But still cheap, as such things go. If I was looking upwards of $20k (which you could be with optioned Ulfs) I'd be real curious to know.
Thanks for the reality check, mine was Club Med compared to yours.

What Eric described to me was something unambiguously SOTA. Like, in the current state of affairs the very best cost no object speakers are getting there by a brute force application of all the old techniques. Its all extremely costly materials and construction techniques. Eric on the other hand is getting his results from a design approach so superior he's able to use off the shelf drivers in rather ordinary cabinets.

This is how it came up, me saying something imagine if you used some of those more esoteric drivers, etc? But yet not having it be a Faberge Egg. That's my term for what Eric calls museum pieces. 

My point is nothing to do with those other speakers. My point is to learn from Eric just how far down that road he's planning on going. Because it has a huge impact on cost. 

If you're really serious about it the hardest part will be getting an answer as to when. Whenever it is, it will be disruptive as all get-out, that's for sure. Meantime, all Be drivers in a Moab or Ulf would sure be nice.
Hey MC, what are your thoughts on this speaker from Eric. It’s called the polycell
https://www.tektondesign.com/polycell-15.html

Well you know he makes speakers for every little niche. Just looking at it, reading the description, this is in his Flagship Models segment and looks to be a more high end version of his Perfect Set 2-10. Yes it can handle a lot of power but the 103dB sensitivity tells me he really made it to be used with flea-watt SET amps. At that price it probably uses some pretty high quality drivers. Look at the close-up shots, looks like a mini-horn array!
That may be the trick. There were times I called and only let it ring a few times, figured they're busy, call again later. Other times I let it ring and ring. Those times Eric would call back. 

When they are shipping you will get at least one email, one with the Owner's Manual and unpacking, another more of an invoice. If I recall, its been a few months. Then Old Dominion will contact you at least once to arrange delivery. Not much longer now! 
You're welcome any time. They sound much better now. Heck they sound much better now than when the guys were here Saturday! Seriously. There was a package on the porch as we were leaving, more TDF magic, you would have to hear it to believe it!
My name for the stuff that sounds so good it must be magic. If it had a name I would use it but since it doesn't that leaves it up to me and since its magic and the sound is to die for that's what I decided to call it. 
Excellent! Thanks!

When he says Moabs make him giddy, even after six months with mine that is just the right word. Listening to Tchaikovsky 1812 last night the power, scale and majesty at the end is beyond impressive and well into giddy. There's Wilsons here in Seattle so expensive the sales tax alone is more than twice what my Moabs cost, and they can keep them, they just don't do it for me.   

Also I talked to Eric a bunch of times on the phone but this reviewer got a much better more complete quote from him than I could put together from all our conversations: 

"Compared to the Moab, the Encore is a bit more laidback. The Encore has the same wonderful midrange and treble — the exact same domes on the tweeters by the way. I'd say the main difference is in the bass. The Encore's bass section is tilted a bit more towards the classic audiophile bass sound. I'd describe it as slightly warmer, smoother, richer. In other words...a bit less energetic and dynamic than the Moab. The Encore mid-bass drivers give it a bit more speed and punch in the mid-bass.

The main difference between the Moab and the Ulfberht is in the mid-bass. The Ulfberht has a lightning-fast mid-bass punch that can only be had through its four lightweight Italian mid-bass drivers. We also switch all of the tweeters over to a ScanSpeak model. This increases the overall system cost but probably doesn't extrapolate to much better sound, as the Moab tweeters are really very good."

This agrees with what he told me, that the Ulf tweeters are better, but in a way that is very hard to hear. We talked about using them in my Moabs and Eric was willing, but then said they are different electrically enough it would require engineering to change the crossovers. Realizing that is not something to be done in a hurry I went with the normal Moab tweeters. Putting it all together I'm left with the impression it may well be part of the reason they are used in the Ulf is for greater cohesion with the other drivers, they may simply be not so much "better" in an absolute sense as  better in terms of matching with the other drivers. 

In any case I can see why teajay told me get the Moabs when he has Ulfs. Moabs are just a super, killer deal. 

The only quibble I have with this review is his comment about inner detail. That's one of my favorite things. I like to listen deep into the recording. Pretty much all the tweaks and mods I make are one way or another aimed at retrieving greater inner detail. Moabs let me hear these changes so easy its not even funny. Remember I posted a while back about rubber bands on my cable elevators? Rubber bands! Freaking obvious! Every tiny little thing I do these speakers present front and center.  

Love em! Pretty cool this guy does too. Only wish he would be more forthcoming letting us know what he's comparing them to. But I guess reviewers have to be careful. Its one thing to say they traded in "five figure Wilsons and Magicos" and quite another to actually list them by name. Oh well. I have not heard ANY Wilson I would trade mine for.

That quote from Eric is money to me. The most exciting, compelling, involving thing about my Moabs is their dynamic this is real live music you are hearing sound. Not hyped in any way, not at all. Just immediate, powerful. Its always hard not to wonder about what could have been. Now reading that quote happier than ever to have gone with the Moab.

Sorry, there's people around here so awful I usually totally ignore everything they post, and this is one of them, but can't let this stand. Eric Alexander is no lunatic. Talked with him a lot all during the whole time my Moabs were on order, and several times thereafter. The delivery date was pushed back several times and it got to the point where that started to get some push back from me. In other words its not like everything was all peaches and cream. But to throw insults like lunatic around, and "turned a new leaf" like he's always been this way, well its just too reprehensible to let stand. 

This is exactly the worst sort of behavior that is making this the kind of site people come to me and say you should leave there's much better sites. No kidding. Do people message you d2girls saying your content is so high quality it deserves a better forum? Course not. Never in a million years. Your content is all just like this, uninformed adolescent insults. 

Now I would greatly appreciate it if you would remove your insolent post. If you will do that then I will remove this one. Either way, just so you know, no matter what you post it will not be responded to, at least not by me. Simply because you have demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt your irredeemable childishness.

Please delete, and move on. 

Thank you.
Of course you can plug the ports. Ported enclosure or sealed, driver works just the same.

The long term plan Eric shared with me is to build a true SOTA speaker, one that will unquestionably outperform all the current monstrosities only at a fraction of the price.

When you think about it this should be eminently doable. He’s already demonstrated his technology allows off the shelf drivers in ordinary MDF cabinets to outperform incredibly well engineered bespoke parts, and for a fraction of the price.

So he's already most of the way there. Imagine if he ups his game to using more advance cabinet materials and design, truly high end crossover components, and the best available drivers. What would really be incredible is if he did this and then kept the same bargain bin outside appearance. To blow away the competition while thumbing his nose at their Faberge Egg beauty pageant mentality would be one for the ages! But I suspect that is a bridge too far even for Eric.

Personally, I would love to see him do just that. Those stupid pretty cabinets alone are easily responsible for half the price of these high end speakers. For him to pass on that would be.... glorious! Put me on the order list for one of those!
speedbump6-
Just got notice that my moabs are finally shipping. Miller, I’d be one of the first in line for those speakers if he builds them. I believe he spoke of another move up the chain a couple of years ago, but haven’t heard any news since that time. I’m sure high demand for current product is keeping him pretty busy as it is.

Congratulations! Dominion will be in touch and get them to your door. You will want a hand truck to take it from there. But I guess you know the drill by now! 😍 First-timers will want to know the box lifts straight up and being so tall requires about a ten foot ceiling! Some may have to unbox outside simply because of that.

As good as Moabs are I would love to see Eric build a more SOTA version. Just the current ones with all Be drivers he feels are better than any of the current crop of High End Furniture. Can only imagine what he could do with advanced materials cabinet curved to eliminate the big flat face, killer crossovers, etc. 

I mean, the crossovers are mounted directly behind the woofer on a brace, a location that makes sense from a wiring point of view but could hardly be worse from a vibration control point of view. Just my usual few tweaks have elevated mine considerably. Eric is a hell of a lot smarter and more talented than me. I'm sure when he can find the time the results will be mind blowing.

Disruptive in the extreme. This is a market long dominated by women. Women and the girly men who buy in a misguided attempt to please them. Some have bought into this so deeply they don't even realize that is what they have done. But that's the real reason everyone tries so hard to make the smallest prettiest speakers possible. Which if anyone knows anything about speakers they know that one thing alone drives price through the roof. 

It may take him a few more years, but if Eric sticks with his philosophy of SOTA for the masses that's about the right time for me to be ready to buy one!
Good question. Moabs do have excellent deep bass. A few times people have wanted to hear them without the subs and even me being used to 5 subs after a few minutes its not like I'm missing much. A lot of people used to the lean hifi sound so many seem to prefer might even be happier that way. For sure Paul said there was a lot of bass. But then he put on the most bass heavy track I ever heard, Billie Eilish or something like that. Felt like my whole room was a sub and I was inside it. 

The thing about it, yes Moab woofers are far apart. But relative to the wavelength they handle they are one. Same as the MTM tweeter array looks spread out, but in terms of the wavelengths they cover its equivalent to one 9" midrange. Eric told me the math a couple times now, but I keep forgetting. Anyway, having four subs spaced 15 to 20 feet apart around the room still does improve the smoothness and extension, regardless of where you set them in terms of level. Just not nearly as much as with other speakers I have had.


Welcome to Audiogon.  Also yours truly is so unabashedly in your face at confronting and exposing them that I am virtually their Great White Whale. Or would be, if they ever read a book, which they have not. Ever.

Then too we have the situation where Eric Alexander has developed a technology that in spite of their inability to understand even a little of it, works so well it has enabled him to sell for $5k speakers that cream the crap they bought (or worship, same difference) for $15k and more.

This thread in other words is a perfect storm of conditions, cheese and peanut butter on a cracker these rats cannot resist.

This all goes on because the mods seem to like it this way. If you read through the thread you probably saw at least a dozen times where I asked these people to move along, please. Not only me, whole bunch of others. Some places there’s a long string of absolutely non-relevant posts. Ask them to please move on. They double down. Mods do nothing.

Whole bunch of people asked them to stop, to go away. Whole bunch of them. One day I cut and pasted all those requests. Fifteen, twenty people saying knock it off, move along, please. That’s all it was. My whole post was nothing but what these others had already said. Their own words.

THIS was the post the mods saw fit to remove. Not the harassment, not the insults. Not the off topic waste of time. Just good well-intentioned people interested only in making the site more relevant, friendly and useful. If you judge by actions, they do not want a site that is relevant, friendly, and useful. They want pages and pages of juvenile sniping and bar room blather.

Probably more of an explanation than you expected. But you did ask. And so now you know.

Over half a year now with my Moabs. Love em, appreciate em, more and more every day.
Moab update-

Originally and for the first several months the Moabs were used on BDR Cones MkIV going down into BDR Round Things on the carpet. They were and still are used with a full Synergistic Research HFT Speaker Kit. 

After a few weeks the drivers were unscrewed and the drivers and internal wiring treated with Total Contact and eMats. The eMats are cut up in strips and are largely recycled/reclaimed from the Talon Khorus they were first used with. 

The eMats work great on all kinds of things but it is clear they work especially well inside speakers, and in particular around the internal wiring. Probably this is due to the high strength and constantly fluctuating energy fields found near speakers and crossovers. Whatever the reason the amount of improvement from even a small amount of this stuff is impressive.  

rixthetrick suggested springs as better than BDR, which seemed unlikely until research turned up yes indeed there is good science behind it. So with his help with springs a very crude test platform was slapped together. Incredibly, this dirt cheap shoddy test rig easily out-performed the much more expensive BDR!   

There was a dramatic reduction in grain and glare, a much more natural, solid, and deep 3D sound stage, and even more inner detail. Very impressive, especially for such cheap springs and shoddy construction. (I outdid myself on that one. No, really. You only think you seen ugly!) 

Eventually John Hannant of Townshend Audio convinced me their Townshend Podiums would be a worthwhile upgrade. They do cost a small fortune, especially compared to my ugly spring test platform. But the Podiums are beautiful, and it turns out John was right, night and day. Everything the test springs did, only better, and with a lot more tonally neutral presentation. Strings, drums, horns, voices- everything is so much more in tune with its natural timbre and tone. Dramatic improvement in clarity. 

It did take a little experimentation. Doesn't it always? We think of springs as isolation so it shouldn't matter what is under them but they do work better with BDR Round Things under them. Maybe because of the carpet? Or it may only be they allowed me to slide the feet around easier and position them more perfectly. Who knows? Bottom line: huge improvement!  

How big? First time coming home after listening to Mike Lavigne's system it made mine sound hopelessly bloated. I thought it was all the room. Mike has the most awe inspiringly perfect room ever! But that was before Podiums, with my MDF test bed springs. Now with Podiums, this time after Mike's there was no shock and hardly any adjustment. Different, sure. Not obviously worse. That is a huge improvement! 
No pics they were so ugly, but they did work. They are still in the room and I need to update some new system pics so if you're really curiousjim PM your email I could send you. I also might list them for sale and see if someone wants a cheap but effective spring platform suitable for just about any speakers from around 110 to 180 lbs. 
Mine are somewhat similar. Townshend Podiums below, BDR Shelf on top. The Shelf on top is directly on the speaker cabinet. Nice improvement in clarity, detail and dynamics. 
nwres-
Still amazed at how well the Nobsound spring pods work under my Tekton's compared to other footers. Clarity, imaging and details across all frequencies. I modified them by securing 1/4 inch 20 threaded studs to each so I could level the speakers and I added gliders so I can easily re-position the speakers. When I upgrade to Moab's or Encore's I will definitely consider auditioning the Townshend products.


Yeah, the Nobsound springs are truly amazing. Springs require a bit of tuning but for guys like us willing to experiment and tweak the results are incredible. They easily outperform all kinds of spikes and cones and footers. The springs fit into 1/4" holes making it easy to build your own custom footers using just the Nobsound springs and your own acrylic, wood or aluminum and drill bit. 

Townshend Podiums and Pods cost a lot more but if you try them I think you will agree they are worth the extra. The main problem with Nobsound and other springs is they resonate and this colors the sound. A big reason they work so well is this coloration is less detrimental to the sound than a lot of the problems with grain and glare that are so common with other footers. Nobody notices those problems, they are ubiquitous, until going to Nobsound they are much less. It is like noise floor, it is so faint nobody notices until they do something to improve it. 

So Townshend eliminates the resonance and this is such a huge improvement you can hardly believe it. Everything just sounds so much more like what it is. Bass is still full and deep but a lot tighter and with even more extension. 

They are also designed in a way that makes them an absolute dream to level. With tall speakers like Moabs this is crucial. Does no good to have the bases be perfectly equidistant if they are tipped so the tweeters are off by inches. Mine are absolutely dialed in and with the image focus to prove it!

Podiums are sized two ways- by platform for speaker size and by springs for speaker weight. The range is pretty wide. My same Podiums would also be the right size for Encores and Ulfberht, and probably Double Impacts as well. It may well be the same ones would work under what you have now as well as what you are planning on later. John Hannant would be able to help you with that.
arcticdeth, I am if anything conservative in my descriptions. Moabs are seriously fine speakers. 
nwres-
MC and Mahgister, yes spring resonance is something I am looking into. I do also keep some mass loading on top of the speakers. Each spring pod had 7 springs and there are 4 pods per speaker. I am considering putting some memory foam inside each spring. Not enough to limit the springs downward movement, but enough to damp. Will report once I give it a try. And MC, thanks for the tips on the Townshend podiums!
Almost missed this what with all the sage audiophiles trying to figure out speaker connections. 😳

Springs are great, tuned and tweaked springs even better, but Townshend Podiums are in a league of their own. Have you tried them?
New pics are up showing Podiums and Pods. Also may notice one or two other things if you look real close.

https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/8367
Okay that is a good project, I will work on getting some pictures up. What you will see, if I can get the right camera angles, they are centered left to right on the Podiums, and further back. There’s about 2" of platform out in front, only about 1/4" in back. Something like that. Not especially fussy, I simply thought that was far enough back to help balance without looking funny, if anyone even would notice but me.

The reason Eric says use with spikes or whatever is simply that the holes for the threads aren’t sealed and go all the way into the cabinet. Something has to be screwed in there or air whooshes in and out. Doesn’t have to be spikes or footers, you could plug or tape, anything that will block air.

Mine are being used exactly the same as on the floor: BDR Cones go down into BDR Round Things. This all sits on the Podiums. Then below the Podium footers are more Round Things. The bottom ones were added mostly to make it a lot easier to fine tune position. Turns out these actually improved the sound quite a bit, a bit of a surprise considering where they are. Another guy here gave me the idea after he found his improved putting them on a platform. Both our situations are on carpet, that may have something to do with it.

You could have edited your post, since you noticed within 30 minutes. Simply click the little gear looking thing and select edit. That’s what I’m doing now. You can do this for 30 minutes. After 30 minutes you can still "edit" but only by using delete to remove the post and then do another one.
Sort of. It started out as a Jungson conditioner. Had a Bybee box before that, they developed quite a following, one of those deals where for a while they are worth more used than they sold for new. The Jungson was only slightly better but I got enough for the Bybee to buy it and a better interconnect, so....

Anyway the Jungson was butt ugly, yes even uglier than that thing there now, and it had only a few cheesy outlets. So I busted it open (rivets, sheesh!) and it was just a transformer and a filter cap, not much more. But whatever it was it worked pretty good so I kept it and built the box you see there now.

220VAC comes in from the step-down transformer 5 feet away, and is hard-wired direct into the isolation transformer. From there are a mix of various wires, some pure silver some copper depending on the component, going to the various outlets- Oyaide, Synergistic Blue, etc.

Also inside the Medusa Conditioner are an Audio Consulting pure silver wire isolation transformer. The Synergistic Research CTS speaker cables use 2 Tesla power supplies for their Active Shielding. The Teslas run through the isolation transformer. There’s two other Active Shielding modules in the back, they power the Active Shielding I added to my phono leads. All those are modified with superior diodes and caps by Michael Spallone. Altogether this makes 6 transformers in there. All this stuff by the way is pasted in TC and wrapped in cut up pieces of eMat.

This all makes for a real mess of wires inside there. I tried posting a few pics but the mods took em down when Squires had a coronary. I know what you’re thinking but no, I mean an actual coronary.

The outlets are cut direct into the MDF, and the sides are mitered and tapered because, vibration control. The whole thing is built on what you can’t see, a base of BDR Black Beauty. Similar to a Source Shelf but without the carbon fiber bling, DJ Casser sent it to me gratis for being such a, you know, awesome audiophile. No. Seriously. He did. I am.

For years this all sat on BDR Cones. Until lately when I discovered springs are much better. So for now it is on Nobsound springs. But that is only until I can get some more Townshend Pods, they are so much better. Yes, even under a power conditioner.


daros71, figure another month or so. You can call and ask Tammy, but it will not be much better. I was originally told one month, then a few weeks later 2 months, then at 2 months was told 2 weeks, then next week a couple times. Main reason I kept calling was just normal following up. It wound up being 3 months and that was before supply chains got all gummed up like they are now. I know lots and lots of things- was looking at some caps and stuff the other day, oh this looks nice, go to order: We are backlogged and taking no new orders until January 22! So relax, main thing remains when you get them man will you be impressed! One of the best you will find, regardless of price.

@millercarbon.
 Nah, the McCormack monos rule the energy rc-70’s, they are so effortless and surprising.
 Never a hint of clipping, or distress!

Yeah, I had a DNA1, fabulous amp. Steve really knows how to build em.
The Moab crossovers have been pulled and tweaked a bit. This has led me to decide to do a complete upgrade. All new copper foil inductors, resistors, and caps. Strongly leaning Path Audio resistors, Dueland and/or Alumen Z-caps, and copper foil inductors. Open to suggestions. Not quite no-holds barred but let's just say this will not be a budget build. 
Now you got me curious, there seems to be another one connected to the amp? WTF?!
I'm with you on everything, except DCR, do you mean LCR? I have a LCR meter and was planning on measuring everything. I don't want to change anything about the crossover, other than of course the quality of the parts which is the whole point.

Air core, ribbon inductors for sure. The iron core I think is what someone called a sledgehammer inductor. The other two might be okay but I plan on replacing all with ribbon inductors. Unless you think no point? You have experience with these, this is my first!

Dueland are insane, would be $2500 for caps alone! But are they worth it??? If they are 'magic' I might just bite the bullet!

Otherwise, pretty well set on V-cap ODAM, Path Audio resistors. Mills it sounds like you're saying save some money not as critical on the woofer. 

This crossover is kind of Phase One. Phase Two, if I ever get to it, will be all new internal wiring with the crossover externally isolated. For now I plan on mounting the new crossover to a Mat on a BDR Shelf isolated on a Townshend Pod, the whole thing slathered in secret sauce;)
That moment when you realize, maybe it was better not to have gotten onto that list after all.....

Thanks grannyring, I might just skip the inductors then and go with Path Audio resistors and Vcap ODAM throughout.

Tom, a lot of the inside is already coated in, er, Rustoleum if you know what I mean. And I set some aside saved just for this project. Probably no Dueland ever made hold a candle to Odams coated in, uh, Rustoleum. ;)
I know resistors and caps will make a huge difference, and as long as they are same value the sound will only improve. But Oh man now you got me scared to change inductors! I do have an LCR meter, what do I need to measure to be sure to get the right inductors without changing the sound?
Almost halfway there then. Only a few more months to go.  

Kidding! Kidding!!! (Sorta;)  

On the Tekton Group Owners page I got a lot of laughs for saying: 

Tekton is like Patek-Philippe, you never really own one, you order it for the next generation. lol!
Wasn't by accident steve59 so thanks. If you do read through I think you will find a lot of really good info.  

Rick we are on the same page. Path Audio resistors for sure. Plan is to pull them out and measure everything tomorrow or Friday. Then call a few like you, hopefully finalize and order Friday/Monday. Every other week is a 4 day weekend, really would like to put the new crossovers in there two weeks from now. 

Was planning on measuring the inductors individually. Did not know about measuring inductor-resistor series resistance, but I can see now how that does make sense. So I should do that for all three inductors, right?

Thanks!
I’m sitting here at my dining table looking out on a just preternaturally perfect verdant PNW spring back yard, then open the page to pure spewage. Oh well. Not actually. Because before coming here I got email alerting me to another DM and it contained this:
But you’re a better man than me - sharing your work and discoveries and opening yourself up to ignorant comments.


Ignorant, indeed. The feedback I get is sort of half like this, half can you please help me, and half man what a bunch of lowlifes WTF is wrong with this site. (Yes I know that adds up to 150%. Whoever said one person mentions only one thing?)

And so I will recommend once again to the other good audiophiles out there, if you do as I do and create a list of people who are total time-wasters you will be surprised how much time it saves simply not reading them. Get your notifications, delete anything with their name. The mods should do this but they won’t. So DIY. I am now at the point where to save time I don’t even let them know, just onto the list they go.

That is all. It really is lovely here btw, Steelhead on the BBQ, cabernet, system warming up, just scored a White Hot Silk Degrees. Life is good.
As much as I enjoy helping people, explaining and teaching, it is really only those who are genuinely interested in learning and enthusiastic about building a better system that I really enjoy helping. I find my life evolving to where there are so many improvements to be done, and genuine audio enthusiasts to help, that there really is no longer a lot of time for trading barbs with people of a certain level of arrogance and ignorance.

The physics of Eric’s MTM array is clearly explained in this thread. Also clearly explained in this thread is the Hateful 18. If you make it onto that list you do not get a response from me, and more often than not do not even get read by me. I see your name, I stop reading. You can see it in action above. A couple really, really want to know something. Too bad.

You are now on there with them. Sorry to say yours is not even a record, one got on there in 3 posts. Still we all need something in life, some form of accomplishment, to give our lives meaning. So you congratulations, you made the list.

Detailed instructions for what to do to get off the list are also in the thread.

Go and read. You will see.
Give it up, Rick. He will never post his system page because it would be an embarrassment. The thing about showing your system, it is the ultimate resume. When your resume is high school dropout, fired from McDonald's, currently awaiting the next stimmie check, no way you are gonna be sending it around. 

Let's just not engage and feed the troll. Let us instead count our blessings. We just ejected Johnnyaudiogoon, and Tammy has asked me to help watch out for his return, so she can suspend him again should he show up under another username. 

We can all hope to one day suspend a few more. I can think of a great place to start. But instead will follow my own rules and not give him the satisfaction of mentioning his name. Not like he's so great anyway, several more just as bad we would all be better off without. 
What I have so far, all the inductors will be upgraded to Erse foilQ.

All the resistors will be upgraded to Path Audio.

The electrolytic will be upgraded to Jantzen Premium ELKO with a Jantzen Alumen Zcap bypass cap. Probably serious overkill but whatever.

The other caps will be upgraded to Jantzen Alumen Zcap with Deulund JDM Silver foil bypass caps.

The whole thing will be mounted on PPT Mat bonded to a BDR Shelf.

This will then be mounted on Townshend Pods screwed into the BDR and the Moab internal mounting brace. Will probably reinforce that brace a bit too.

There's a bunch more little doo-dads of course but that is the gist of it. For now. Everybody, as Iron Mike says, has a plan until they get punched in the face. Or start soldering. Same difference, right?
No worries Tom, I have a painter on the east coast, use only her hand-mixed Rustoleum. The metal flake is to die for. 

I will be using all Path Audio resistors. Caps are mostly Jantzen Alumen Zcaps with Deulund JDM Silver bypass caps. Erse inductors. Assuming I can even get this stuff. All the Erse inductors are backordered, and wouldn't surprise me if some of the caps are too.
125. Actually measures 126.  

Yes, I have seen many examples of things "outside the signal path" that "can’t affect the sound" BUT DO! Jantzen Premium ELKO with Alumen Zcap bypass planned to replace the electrolytic. Path Audio resistors to replace the cement ones.
Too late! I have already decided there is so much I have learned about crossovers (a lot from you!) it is not fair to put a lot of that in here and so this will be Millercarbon’s Crossover Upgrade Project. Coming Soon!
The shunt capacitor does indeed play an important role and impacts the sound of the speaker in important ways. Try removing it and listen 😊. It actually impacts the the sound of the circuit after it. No kidding .

This^. I believe you.  

It might seem to some just looking at it that the current goes through the woofers and the resistor and cap cannot matter because they are after the woofer and on the path to ground. But like you said, try removing it and see. And yes I know you were joking. Sort of. It really does matter, just not as much as the mid/tweeter caps.
So no Duelund on the shunt. The Jantzen I have is probably overkill. But the way I look at it, I am not about to turn this into a months long project trying one thing at a time to learn what is worth doing and what is not. That would make total sense for a builder or if I was doing this more than once. But being as I am not doing it more than once then it makes more sense to just be sure and do it right. One and done, then onto the next project.

It is of course always possible this winds up being only the first stage. Might well be it is just an intermediate step towards eventually moving the crossover outboard and upgrading all the internal wiring. There is probably 50/50 odds of that. But then if that happens it still makes sense to do it this way, because then when the crossover is outside all these little component swaps become a whole lot easier.

We will just have to see how it goes. Haven’t even ordered the parts yet. Some of this stuff is like everything else these days on backorder!

I thank Mike Lenehan (Lenehan Audio) for teaching me all that I know about crossover building and design.

And I thank you for passing some of it along to me!

If you feel my participation here is a challenge to your control or you have no interest in what we discovered with the Tekton Loudspeaker systems, I am more than happy to vacate your wholly owned thread.

What a total piece of work. Dishonest to the core. More than happy to vacate, then do so. Please.

Wow. Every once in a while someone truly alert and adept thinks of something so obvious its a total "I coulda had a V8" moment. This is one. Why this never occurred to me before I cannot even imagine. Probably I was thrown off by things like professional reviewer teajay saying the Moab is so close to the Ulf there's only a shade more power in the low midrange/upper bass between them. But not you! You figured out what we could not! What a total waste of time this has been. Sorry. So very, very sorry. How can you ever forgive me??
Seriously? This is the level of childishness? Yes everything matters. Every tiny little thing makes a difference. But not every tiny little thing is worth getting your panties in a twist over. So give em a tug, tidy up, and try and do better next time.
Such twaddle. Where does it come from? Have a feeling psychologists call it projection- small minded people project all their weaknesses, failings and bad intent onto others. You really should take the time to read through all my posting history. If not to learn massive amounts about audio then at least to see the folly of trying to insult and troll someone vastly better at it than you could ever even dream of being.

From my posts you will learn my mentor was Stewart Marcantoni, a man who had probably the best ears and knowledge of high end audio I ever met. You think I’m enamored with Eric? Because I mention his name a lot in a thread devoted to his products? Logic truly is foreign to you.

Stewart introduced me to Ted Denney way back in 1993 or 4. Caelin of Shunyata brought some of his latest power cords over to a party at my place a year or so later. Before buying my first turntable Michael Fremer called me and we talked tables, arms and cartridges. Years later when upgrading it I met Teres Audio founder Chris Brady who also was over and in my room one time when he was in Seattle. There’s enough of these stories I find a bunch of them I can’t even remember their names. The year I went to CES I had a vendor pass not general public. Yet I’m supposed to be like a kid in a candy store because I talked to Eric on the phone. Hilarious.
Move along, please.