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System building; a meditation

System building; a meditation

This is an offshoot of a posting I made in a different thread; that is, what is one’s approach to building a system out of various components that maximizes the sonic attributes of the combination of particular components?There’s been some push-back on “tweaks” but leave that to the side for now. How does one select what components to include in a system, putting to one side budgetary constraints? (the budget thing can be solved in several ways, including through used and through a deliberate strategy to acquire certain components over time that achieve a certain result- my point being, if it weren’t simply a constraint of capital, how does one choose?)

There seem to be a few rules that we abide by- the relationship of amp to speaker being fundamental. The choice of front end –from DIY digital to high end analog is also a choice, but I’ll be agnostic in this regard even though I came up through the LP and still regard it as the mainstream medium of choice, simply because of the wealth of material in older records.

How do people choose the combinations of equipment they employ? Is it happenstance, the gradual upgrading of each component to a high standard or some other benchmark for what the system is supposed to do that necessitates certain choices?

For what it is worth, I don’t endorse one single approach; I went from electrostat listening (including ribbon tweets and subs) to horns, sort of (Avantgardes plus subs) and SET as one choice, but have heard marvelous systems using larger, relatively inefficient dynamic set ups (Magico; Rockport, TG, etc.) combined with big solid state power that left a very positive impression.

How do you sort through the thicket? It isn’t just specs, and listening within your system to evaluate is an ideal, but I’m opening this up to system building in general—what approach do you take? I’m not sure there is a single formala, but thought it worth exploring since it seems to be an undercurrent in a lot of equipment changes without addressing the “why?” of it or how one makes these choices.

I know that we are mired in a subjective hobby, and almost every system is different, even if the components are the same in a different room, but thought this might be an interesting topic for discussion. If not, the lack of responses will prove me wrong. I don’t have a single answer to this FWIW.


128x128whart

Showing 6 responses by holmz

holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
I dunno… when I started the preamp and amp were often shown with the speaker I choose. And the speaker was one that was tolerant of many amplifiers. So that makes it a bit easier IMO.

In an objective sense, one could use a known waveform and gated measurements without reflections, and then determine impulse response, amplitude response and frequency response… or some metric on THD, IMD, Phase distortion, and be able to make a fact based decision. But that may still leave something subjective on the table.

If we ignore the room, then the speakers can often be the most distorted component in the chain. Once the speakers get good, then rest have a chance of being heard. Of if the component distortions and colour are significant then they should be hearable at some ratio relative to the where speakers are not ideal.

Starting off with speaker that are easy to drive, and have a flattish impedance, still seems like an easier starting place.

But when my first amp died i replaced it with a VTL, and then recently with PrimaLuna.
The preamp was replaced with a tube unit because the sales person said it would be best place to spend up, along with a phono stage…
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
Let’s pretend that equipment is the lessor part of the whole enchilada…
In that case I would be spruiking Dirac, or other EQ and room compensation schemes.

At some point having an SO can be worthwhile, or at least a more costly upgrade than the audio… So the concept off “the ideal room” may vary between people sharing the house/home.

I got my gear pre-SO(s), and have always had a hard time getting it into the living space. Maybe lessor quality speakers, or a newer model, would help? But, as the tautology goes… “it is what it is.”

If one ready has an SO, then it is probably worth engaging them early in the process.

The last unit (AVR - which is on the way), had the SO saying, “at least it doesn’t look bad.” ;)
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
“I really like those..." (...pointing @ the small Maggies'...).
She says that my 2Cs are, “Well at least not as ugly as (my friend) MIke’s monstrosities (Maggies).”

She has had some Ricther bookshelf ported 2 ways for ~30 years, which do not sound bad, and a NAD integrated amp. It’s pretty good for what it is. The wood looking vinyl looking cover falling off them detracts from their beauty IMO.

She knows that her speakers are better, because with mine she cannot even hear the speakers, just the music. ;)

holmz, when the SO enjoys what her prefs are to having a strong opinion as to What to listen to it On....*!*
  • “On” a low volume ;) or… with no music playing.
  • Or… “On” the same content as the picture on the screen.

  • With music, she prefers to have me queue up the Turntable.
  • She always goes for iPad, because it is not complicated. And it is always low background furniture music (in Satie’s terms).

  • And in the car, she normally “Mans” the iPad into the BT… mostly so that I do not choose albums that she doesn’t care for. (Or podcasts that she doesn’t abide.)
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
But the physical speaker itself is also imprinting on the effect of the room. You being in the room is another factor. This is what I mean by (sonic) 'fingerprint'.  

I am picturing “a disturbance in the force”.
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
… Have you ever seen a passage of music analyzed on an oscilloscope for input and output integrity? Nope, you haven’t. And square waves at fixed frequencies make for easy measurements but they don’t emulate music. I will skip right over the fact that many amplifiers and preamps that measure as "state of the art" on the test bench don’t sound "right".
I have seen Dirac Live.
and
I have seen other room correction S/W.

and… I have seen before and after impulse response from group delay corrections of speakers.

^They^/^Those^/^Them^ usually sound more right than wrong.

Or is that something different?

They are all doing a “signal integrity” by comparing a known signal, to what is coming out of the complete system, and then altering the system digitally to compensate for the system’s response as well as the room’s response. 
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
@douglas_schroeder  ;)
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