Subwoofer Suggestion


Hi guys I need your suggestion regarding subwoofers. My system is composed of Focal Kanta 3, Kanta center, 706BK it would be used 50/50 for music and HT. My room size would be 13m by 4m by 3(Length,width,height). Would it be better to go for dual pb1000/sb1000 or single sb3000 or single pb2000 or single PSA S1500?
kulo
If you are going to use a sub two or more is the way you should go.
Even though the other's woofer is 3 inches bigger?
To put it simply, using more than one sub helps cancel out peaks and nulls.  With one subwoofer, you may have spots where there is too much bass, and not enough in others.  Four small ones would be much better than one big one.  Do a search here for "swarm", lots of discussion and information available. 

Not to mention, you have a pretty large room.
Four small subwoofers instead of one big one.So just using a subwoofer is out now you need multiple subwoofers.REALLY. How about one big one like 18 inches and then a small one in every  corner. Bingo.No wait I have a 11.1 system....speakers everywhere.....Remember less is more.
Oh boy, I sure would like to hear those Kanta 3’s. Extending their bass, for music sometimes? For video sometimes? Complicated!!!

My advice: Stereo Pair of Subs located with the mains to maintain imaging. Careful control of crossover and volume. Self-powered, independent of the video system, i.e. extended bass ALWAYS.

As you must already know with your speakers, low bass is more directional than many think, and it has been pointed out, the narrower overtones of the wide low bass fundamentals give directional cues to the fundamental’s location.
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The better the mains, the harder it is to achieve seamless extension, and you probably cannot personally listen, likely buy un-heard, I would want full return/refund (not store credit).

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If ONLY for Video, adding bass effects i.e. Dinosaur Stomps, a single self-powered sub will work, balanced to be unaware of location or contribution unless you turn it off. But ....

When via 5.1, using sub out, then when using ’direct’ which is often 2 channel, or 2 channel mode, often the content’s original format, the sub will be off, no extra bass. I very often find the cable company or my AVR send/invent/use surround without me choosing it, and 2 channel sounds better. Therefore, for ANY home theater, you still need a decent amount of bass from your mains.

For stereo music or stereo video, extended bass always, a stereo pair of subs is needed, and very carefully chosen and controlled crossover/volume to work seamlessly with your existing mains. They need to be self-powered to maintain independence from AVR system.


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I suggest you further arm yourself for evaluation.

piano lows, bass, drums: I prefer using stand-up bass to evaluate bass: quality, control, directionality.

scroll down to chart of frequencies

https://www.studybass.com/gear/bass-tone-and-eq/bass-frequency-range/

unique double bass album

https://www.discogs.com/Niels-Henning-%C3%98rsted-Pedersen-Sam-Jones-Double-Bass/release/1703343

mingus dynasty, two bass players, opposite channels in 7 piece band

https://www.discogs.com/Mingus-Dynasty-Live-At-Montreux/release/1448034

Duets, alto sax and upright bass only.

https://www.discogs.com/Lee-Konitz-Red-Mitchell-I-Concentrate-On-You-A-Tribute-To-Cole-Porter/release/2436055

aside from wonderful music, the full range and textures of Red Mitchell’s bass are there for every track, and a long bass solo on the last 9 minute track, incredible. No masking of drums, guitars ...
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my music system: horns with 15" woofers, no sub

my video system, single self-powered sub, via 5.1, mains have 10" woofers for bass without sub, sub far from mains

my office system, bookshelf with single self powered sub, always in. music and video from 27" monitor/pc
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good luck extending those beauties. btw, manufacturer probably has some advice, perhaps knows what other owners have tried/done.

Elliott







So just using a subwoofer is out
Certainly not.  Do whatever floats your boat.


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I just auditioned a pair of RSL Speedwoofers.  This is a compact 10 inch sub that has to be the best value sub for the money I have heard.  It can reach down solidly to 25hz, is compact, all for a bagain price of $400.  Shipping and return shipping included!  So get 4 of these subs and you ought to have effortless, smooth bass well suited for a 50/50 split of music and HT.  What have you got to lose?  Highly doubt you would return them
I have 4 systems - main (living room), office, bedroom, computer room. My living room is pretty big and opens into my kitchen. 4 subs there. All the others have a single sealed sub and sound great. 

If your goal is gut punching bass, you need big powerful subs. That's not what I'm trying to achieve when listening to music (although I have the gear to do that).  If there's bass content in the music, I hear it much like it would sound live. And when there's some really deep bass, it is visceral.

The OP has a big room. Multiple subs are the easy button for well integrated bass if there's room and budget. 
Thanks for your opinion guys, the dealer recommended the Focal sub 1000 F although I haven't heard it, I'm pretty sure that it won't be
enough for my room and I think I can do better with PSA or svs subs for that amoutn of money.
Elliot sadly it doesn't reach deep enough
compared to the Revel studio2 that I auditioned. I've just recently made the purchase, this is my first hi fi system. To be honest, I'm still trying to decipher your response since I am relatively new to speakers. By the way upgrading later on isn't an option since my dad just wants a one and done system.
Thanks for your suggestion corelli, sadly, there aren't any RSL dealers here in Philippines. Svs, rel, and PSA are the only ones available to me. Also, my maximum budget that I am allowed to spend is around 77k php which is around 1500usd. Also svs subs are like almost double the srp here compared to the US, so I can't really go 4 subs unless I go for klipsch.
Two of the sealed SVS-SB 1000 should do the trick!  
I just fear that maybe the sb1000 wouldn't go deep enough, and for the pb1000 not to go tight enough. 
Two of the sealed SVS-SB 1000 should do the trick!  

SVS or PSA over Focal or Klipsch. The 1000 series SVS subs are entry level and under-sized for that room. If the desired outcome is to add a little more bass, they'll do that, but if you're expecting a major improvement, you may be disappointed. Only one way to find out. Can you return them? 
Testing it wouldn't be possible. So since dual sb or pb1000 is underpowered would it be better if I go for a 15inch PSA S1500?
Can you return them?

It would be underpowered for me, maybe not for you. Forced to choose, I'd take two small subs over one big one for that sized room. 
I have quite a large room (28'x15x10-14', my ceiling slopes a little). I've rearranged this room a bunch of times and have had to find different places for my sub (REL T9). I only use it for listening to music (no TV). I've used the step by step set-up instructions from REL every time I've rearranged this room. I've been able to get amazing performance out of this sub every time. I think this speaks to the quality and thoughtfulness that they put into their products. There's one additional step I take setting up my REL. If you go down that road, DM me and I'll tell you about it. 
I recently added a stereo pair of REL T/9i subwoofers to my Magnepan 1.7i pair. They have revolutionized my system. I’m a believer and vote for REL. Use the high level input. Good luck. 
For stereo I use dual Rythmick F12 sealed  subs. Loads of adjustments to make them disappear into the speakers. Plenty of power at 370 watts each with very tight musical bass. They have ported subs better fitted for HT.
I've asked for the price of rel t9i and it costs 1900usd it's out of my budget. 
If you go down that road, DM me and I'll tell you about it

Baylinor I'm dying to try a rythmik sub but sadly there are no dealers here in my country.
@kulo  it doesn't have to be T9. Maybe go for the T7? The T9 is more than enough for my room. 
Kulo, where did you get that name? Hee Hee I just noticed that..

What about PE can you get their stuff where your at? They ship everywhere, I thought..

They have good units you can build from flat packs or they have a few premade units, too.

It’s an idea anyways.

Regards
Edicionretro I don't think an 8 inch woofer would be enough for the size of my room.
oldhvymec I just made a shortcut for my first and last name😂. I'm not familiar with the brand PE, also customs tax here is terrifying, if it wasn't I would have ordered in the US where everything is so cheap HAHAHAHAH
What about HSU subwoofers? Reading the fine print on their webpage they ship outside of the US and take PayPal and wire transfer (etc.), but some coordination needs to be done before the purchase by contacting them directly.

If under $1500 you could purchase two 12” VTF-2s + shipping or one 15” VTF-3 + shipping. Shipment will be from California. Ported and sealed mode for 50/50 music/movies if desired.
What about HSU subwoofers?
I can't risk buying in other countries even though it's cheaper there because there are occasions where the customs would charge as much as 30% of the srp.
Either the largest HSU Research subs or El Pipo from the DIY plans available free in the web
Bobedwards 101 I can't buy subs in other countries due to tax issues.
the swarm by audiokinesis
I got the DEBRA array (4x 10” passive subs powered by 2x 1000w amps in my 15x20 room. I’ve tried upgrading speakers and still no bass (Tannoy Turnberry). Turns out it’s because of the standing waves in the room. I tried changing speaker location and listening spot- a little improvement. Once I added the DEBRA, completely got rid of my bass problems and blends perfectly. Best money spent on my system so far. 
I've checked the Debra array sadly it's again out of my budget. Now I'm starting to think that I spent too much on amplifier and speaker😂
One of the suggestions is build your own subs. Your own homemade DEBRA/swarm system.  Here is the amp used:

https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-sa1000-subwoofer-amplifier-rack-mountable--300-811

And a cheaper alternative:

https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-sa230-230w-subwoofer-amplifier--300-813

The setup instructions are on the "debra" website. Just need to build four small  passive subwoofers. Build from scratch ( or pay a local carpenter/cabinet maker) with plans or buy a kit for 8" or 10" subs.

Ow I get it now, lol my dad would never let me do those though asian parents HAHAHAHAH
@kulo      Just so you know, RSL does not have dealers and they do ship all over the world.  You could do three subs for $1200.  Heck, you might be happy with two!  They really are a great value.
When I brought the kanta 3 home I loved the mids and highs but the bass was a mess, +10db at 100hz and -20 at 80 hz with a little recovery around 60 hz b4 falling off the chart. My room. Moving them to the long wall and playing with boundary placement did smooth them out a lot, but they never did offer much below 70 hz in my room. I would try a single sub between the speakers first and if that don't work then buy the second. A flat measuring speaker isn't necessarily desirable and the Kanta only needs help with the bottom 2 octaves.
Corelli I'll check the rsl subs, I'll take it into consideration thank you.
steve59 may I know the sub you used for your room?
First of all you need a continuous phase control, polarity control and multiple crossover slopes.

Second you need to roll the lows out of the mains. Doubly important with ported mains. This can be a simple 1st order capacitor crossover to the main amp.

Third, a sub with a control app to equalize the bottom to the room can do wonders.

Among others, the Martin Logan x series have all of the above. 

see  http://www.ielogical.com/Audio/SubTerrBlues.php for setup and general sub info. The Finally graph shows the proof of the pudding is in the eating.
I just added dual Rythmik L22s to support my Tekton Pendragons, and I’m very happy with the sound after weeks spent integrating. As stated above, consider rolling off the mains. I use a K231 active crossover at 70-80hz, and this creates incredibly powerful and tight bass from the subs, while allowing the mains to offload the lowest freqs, which cleans up the entire midrange. This method is challenging, and it can sound weak down low until everything is properly dialed in and integrated. Then you have deep bass, clean low-mids, clearer voices, and a sense the bass is truly emanating from the same world as the rest of the music. It’s labor intensive to dial in, but I found it way better than running the mains full range and reinforcing with subs, which led me to different flavors of muddy midrange. This is very system/room dependent, and may not work for you, but hope it helps! Getting bass right makes everything better.
@kulo The REL T/9i retails for $1299 USD. But in my experience you can buy them (I bought two) for a discount from a dealer in the US. I don’t know where you are located. 
I'll give this a try thank you.
As stated above, consider rolling off the mains.

king baracyda I'm located in Philippines, everything here is so expensive compared to US.
Thanks ieales I'll check the prices of martin logan subs here thank you.
@Kulo:

El Pipe-O is a DIY sub. Quite a large variety of woofers can be used as drivers. I’m sure you could find a suitable pair locally. 
Well I'm not really looking for a diy sub, but if all else fails I'll give it a try thank you.
I bought 2 SVS sb2000 subs on sale for $650 each (price reduced when they brought out the sb2000 pro model).  They compliment my Martin Logan 60XT towers.  I set the crossover at 80HZ and let the subs handle frequencies below that.  Room placement is not optimized and I seldom play music real loud.   I’m not sure I have them dialed in correctly — read somewhere that mains show be set at 20 HZ and let the subs handle below that (?).  Don’t know if that advice works or not.