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Stereophile confirms new gear is getting worse....

It appears that "high end" audio gear is moving backwards rather than forwards. If you doubt this, take a look at the November 2003 issue and the test results of the electronics reviewed.

As a case in point, the Pass XA160 mono-block amps that were reviewed perform pretty horribly. While most folks that read these forums know that i'm not shy about being a fan of Nelson Pass' work, i don't have much good to say about these over-priced boat anchors. Most will probably remember what a hard time that i gave the PS Audio HCA-2. In effect, most of the comments that i made about that amp apply to this amp. From what i can tell, the comments that i made about the PS may not be strong enough as compared to how poorly the XA160's performed, especially at the price. Lack of current output, high distortion figures, non-linear frequency responses, the ability for the loudspeaker to modulate the output of the amp, etc... were all evident in the test results. To top it off, the input and output impedances will make this unit quite sensitive to the components ( preamp, speakers, etc...) that it is mated with.

Regardless of who's name is on this unit, how "pretty" it looks ( gorgeous ), what it weighs (200 lbs per monoblock) and the parts quality inside, quite honestly, this unit performed like a really crappy "vintage" ( read that as "low tech" ) tubed unit from the days prior to audio civilization. All this "eye candy" and a sore back for only $18K a pair !!!

As we move to the next product review, we look at the BAT VK-51SE. While this unit was more consistent than the Pass, some of the design choices made are obviously not good ones. The most obvious flaw that i see with this unit is that it changes sound / tonal balance as the volume is varied. Even when the gain control is adjusted for the flattest response, the top end starts sloping off gradually above 5 KHz. As you increase the gain, you now introduce low frequency roll-off into the equation also. If really standing on the throttle, the unit doesn't even make it down to 100 Hz within a -3 dB tolerance window !!! Obviously, this is not very good or linear and is poorer performance than one would expect out of a "reasonable" pair of speakers, NOT line level components !!!

As such, you can't expect consistent sonics from this unit unless you listen at one gain setting. If you have only one source component and all your recordings are of the same intensity, you "might" be able to find a reasonable setting. Since i highly doubt that this is the case, especially the part about consistent volume from recording to recording, you can pretty much count this out.

On top of the variations that this unit produces on its' own, one can introduce a whole new gang of variables into the equation once you start factoring in input / output impedances into the equation. I'll just say that this unit isn't going to be very versatile in terms of what components it mates up with in terms of amp selection. All this "high tech performance" for only $8500. Make that $9000 if you want the convenience of a remote.

Moving a few pages further, we run into the "giant killer" AH! Njoe Tjoeb ( pronounced "new tube" ) 4000 cd player. This is a highly modified / hot-rodded Marantz unit with tubes added, a "super clock" and the option of a "plug & play" upsampling board, fancy footers and an upgraded power cord. Depending on what you want to spend, the base unit is $700. If you go for the unit fully loaded with options, you can feel your bank account drained to the tune of about $1200.

Take one look at the frequency response of this unit and you'll see that it is far from "neutral". To top it off, distortions are higher along with a lack of suppression of AC harmonics. Jitter is pretty high for a unit with a "superclock" i.e. higher than other units i've seen with no "superclock". As such, this unit doesn't appear to be a "killer" of any type other than being able to "flatten your wallet in one swift motion".

Obviously, "high end" has come full circle. That is, it would appear that "audiophiles" are more concerned with asthaetics and reputation than actual performance and fidelity. The folks that used to laugh at Bang & Olufsen are now falling for looks at an even higher price. While the sonics may differ from Bang & Olufsen, the end result is that none of these units are "accurate" or capable of being called "high fidelity" units any more than Bang & Olufsen gear of yester-year was. The fact that B&O are now trying to jump back into "high end" with some truly innovative products just goes to show that one can't judge a company or product by its' cover any more.

Having said that, the above mentioned products can't really be called "Hi-Fi components". What they can be called are "flavoured audiophile toys". The funny thing is that J. Gordon Holt had commented on this type of situation arising within the industry and there are letters in this issue agreeing with that point of view. J. Peter Moncrieff also talked about that in IAR Hotline 76-80 quite a while back and found it rather pathetic. Count me in with that crowd too.

I do have to credit JA and the guys for having the guts to print these test results. While there is plenty of "dancing" in all of the reviews along with more than enough "gushing" ( the Pass review in specific ), it was pretty obvious that JA really DID make mention of the technical problems that each of these products displayed. As usual, Stereophile remains consistent in the fact that they continue to test, measure and display the results for all to see. For this, i offer a very hardy pat on the back, vigorous hand-clapping and whistling. THANK YOU from all of us that like reading and interpreting spec's for ourselves. Having said that, JA still tried to down-play these flaws somewhat by giving the "old soft shoe" at the end of his technical comments.

As i've said before, one has to buy and use what they like and makes them happy. With all of the various and BLATANT "flavouring" that is going on with audio gear nowadays, one really must know what they want and how well components will blend together in their system. It would appear that the days of trying to achieve "accuracy" and "musicality" with with each piece of gear are over. Now audio is kind of like Baskin-Robbins i.e. you've got to know what you like before you order what are VERY specific "flavours" for each product selected.

Let the buyer beware.... Sean
>

PS... I've got my flame repellent armour on along with an oxygen tank and a full battery of weapons. After this post and the responses that i think i'll get, i know that i'll need all of that and maybe more : )
sean

Showing 5 responses by stevecham

stevecham
3,340 posts
 
Sean, no need to put the armour on (A Brit are ya?), no flames from me on this topic and I reflect most of your sentiments. And I like it when someone has the courage to put a stake in the ground and stand by it. Kudos to you.

Buyer Beware is front and center for any major outlay of resources. In my opinion there is absolutely NO EXCUSE for releasing-for-sale products of poor measured performance in ANY component in this day and age, unless of course it's done strictly for reasons of greed (flames here). I don't really care how damn good the thing is supposed to BE esoterically or how "sweet" it sounds under certain EXCEPTIONAL and unrealistic situations e.g. with certain music styles only or with interconnects/speaker cables that prevent the damn thing from going into runaway oscillation, or with extremely sensitive speakers (90+dB) at 10 OHms and above, it's got to measure well. Also, input and output impedances should be realistically designed to meet the needs of the real world in terms of electrical compatibility, unless that manufacturer is also prepared to provide all the components necessary for an "exceptional configuration."

I uphold the school that states that measured performance does indeed correlate to system performance, intercomponent compatibility and long term listening pleasure.

Why anyone would want anything other than pure neutrality in a music playback system, and let the flavoring occur via the music selected for listening alone, is beyond me (flames here). But then that's my view.

If such manufacturers want to make gear that would have intercomponent measurement anomalies, then they should make all-in-one credenzas like the stereos of the 60s that they have all the source components, pres, amps and speaker configurations in one unit. This way we can't see the wierd stuff going on between the electronics and all the user has to "worry" about is how it sounds and what he she puts in/on the CD/LP/Tuner etc and where the 117 VAC in the wall is.

Kind of like Bose Wave system.

Otherwise if it HAS inputs and outputs, make it measure, interact well with, and "play ball with the rest of the kids in the playground."

In the end we must ask how long manufacturers of gear with poor measured performance actually last in the modern high end industry.

Can I borrow your flame repellent armour and O2 tank, I think I'm gonna need it. (Perhaps a review of such speacialized gear is in order too under a separate thread.) ;-0
stevecham
3,340 posts
 
I also think it would be interesting for a manufacturer to step forward bravely and allow JA or others to test a piece of equipment, say 10 of 100 that were built, and those 10 represent the beginning, middle and end of the build run. Then plot the findings as a statistical analysis showing the standard deviation within the build run. That way we would get to see what variations can occur between units built to a particular spec. It would be a huge risk to agree to but could also be an important reward for such a participating manufacturer. So many times in Stereophile we have seen the review sample returned to the manufacturer for "problems" and a replacement sent back that was analysed and listened to that sounded and spec'd better.
stevecham
3,340 posts
 
at least if combined with a tank of acetylene one can perform welds where needed ;-)
stevecham
3,340 posts
 
I'm compelled to jump in here. By the way this is one of the better threads I've read and I certainly will do my best to contribute to it and not degrade it. You can be sure that if there are industry heads out there trolling through agon, this is exactly the type of thread that will catch their attention.

One thing I've noticed that seems to be very consistent in the reviewing industry (TAS, Stereophile and a few small others) is that so, so often, components are evaluated and compared as if they were stand alone products. If one believes that the ultimate evaluation of ANY component is via the listening experience alone, then it becomes prudent on the part of the evaluator to ensure that the review is taken in the context of the SYSTEM in which the piece is evaluated. As we all know, it is that very undefined and poorly understood realm of component interaction added to the electronic and mechanical complexities of software and hardware that govern what ultimately comes off the speaker/headphone drivers to reach our ears. Coupled to this the very real effects of the emotional and physical states of our heads and bodies on any particular day, hour , minute and the variables take on astronomical proportions.

Point: I attended the Home Theatre Show in San Francisco last year with my wife and two other audio/music enthusiast friends and when we found the Quad room I encouraged the four of us to sit down and just listen awhile. First let me say that I don't think these shows are the place to evaluate gear appropriately for many reasons, some of these being the music played, the distractive noises of other show attendees, the size and shape of the room (an older downtown hotel, The St Francis Westin in this case), and the placement of chairs in which to "relax" and listen. The room was packed, as if the faithful and the devoted had finally found nirvana. Several people held their heads back in what appeared to be a state of rapture. We sat and listened for a good ten minutes, obviously not long enough to obtain a full experience, bit long enough, at least for me, to understand the system's strengths and weaknesses.

I couldn't get into it. Whether it was the speakers (the latest Quads, I forget the model), the cables, the electronics or sources, I couldn't tell. But there was NO bass, the midrange did not make me even feel the slightest punch in the chest (no guts but all cerebral). The recording was one I was familir with too. After ten minutes we looked at each other and left the room while the devoted were still enraptured.

My point? I had read about these speakers in a review sometime last year in either TAS or Stereophile (or both!) and I had made a point of checking this gear out while at the show. What I heard (and my wife and friends heard) in no way even came close to the kudos that those reviews engendered. It was apples and oranges. So my point is that (and it supports Nrchy's as well) is that if we can't be present in the same time and space as the reviewer of equipment, let alone the same emotional and physical state, then certainly much will be lost in the translation. In fact almost all of it will be lost. In fact no review can provide value to us besides piquing our interest enough to get off our fat butts and go listen in a context completely removed from any reviewer's experience.

At best this will mean home auditioning. At worst, purchasing based solely on specs or review. The spectrum for folly is of extremely wide bandwidth and huge dynamic range. We all forge our own path to audio disillusion and disbelief; I celebrate dissent in this area of personal pursuit simply because in music, there are no absolutes but only possibilities. The world of audio gear combinations, configurations and experiences is no different in this regard.

But it certainly is fun hanging out with you folks.
stevecham
3,340 posts
 
Wait a minute, there is no such thing as accuracy when it comes to sound, musical or otherwise. That is simply because in order for it to be accurate, it must have quantitative parameters that can be measured. And there is no way in heck that what is heard in a live musical situation can be accurately measured and then compared to a non-live (recorded) listening experience.

Subjectivity excludes the possibility of accuracy.

The point is moot. And I agree totally with Sean when I read about $15,000 speaker systems that can't achieve a MEASURABLE linear (+/- 3dB) frequency response below 50 Hz. The development, manufacture and release for sale of such equipment is simply, and utterly ridiculous and ANYONE paying $$$ for such garbage should have their head examined.
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