Skeptic or just plain hard headed


So I purchased a pair of Morrow Audio phono cables. These are the PH3 with the Eichmann connectors. Wanted to start there to see if MA cables will be a viable option for my system.I think my story is not so unique to others who have purchased MA cables. So no need to go into the hu hum of burn-in in regards to MA cables, and how things sound bad at first, then gets better,  then excellent...yada yada yada. I know the story about this product.  I simply am one who is not a believer in electronics break in periods, or battery packs on cables, etc... Regardless of what side of the fence you are on in regards to that Im NOT trying to start that debate again please.. Anyway. After reading several reviews of the MA cables and understanding that most agreed that the cables needed a substantial burn-in time, and that the cables would not sound its best until this happens I decided to give them a try. Thinking ok lets get a jump on the burn-in period (if the concept is true). I paid for the 2 day burn-in service from MA. What I didn't expect is that when I got the cable it would sound as bad as it did in comparison to my existing name brand cable (not getting into that either, not relevant). I thought well the cable might not quite be up to snuff with all this talk about burn-in (if its true) but not that much of a difference.  I mean as soon as I dropped the needle on the record I immediately heard a profound difference in sound stage and clarity degridation. Needless to say this cable was destined to be returned to MA for a full refund and my thinking was "they are crazy if I am going to trade my cable for this cable" So I decided to give MA a call to setup the return. Talked with Mike Morrow (very nice guy by the way) and we had our differences in what I should expect out of his product. Now my Mother always told me that I have a hard head.. I heard that growing up all my life, and when you couple that with skepticism it makes a pretty, well lets just say not a very fun person to have a debate with lol. However Mike insisted that if I return the cable that I would be missing out on the fruit they would bare after 400 hours of break in. 400 hours??? really!. Oh at that point I was really ready to return them. I told all my friends "Mike must be nuts" (no offense Mike) no way am I going to wait a year to hear what this cable is capable of, AND I do not have any way to expedite the process...at least I thought I didn't until I found an old sound bar I don't use anymore with analog inputs. Ok I know you pro MA and  pro cable burn-in folks are chomping at the bit. Im almost done. Take your hands off the keyboard for just a few more lines. 

So here is the deal to be fair I am going to be open minded about this because Mike really made me feel like I would be missing out if I return the cable without a proper burn-in (great salesman), and since he had such conviction I now think I have to test this thing out right??. Now I know that there are testimonials out there about how the MA cable improved over 100s of hours in their system, and that they are now "blown away". However can you really hear a profound difference in a cable you play in your system over 170 hours or so?  I would think a gradual difference would be harder to detect. I mean my system seems to sound better to me everyday without making any changes. Is it because of  continued cable and electronics burn in?? maybe. Or maybe its just my brain becoming more intimate with the sound of my system. Well this test I'm doing should reveal a night and day difference from what the system sounds like today with the cable pre burn-in if there is any merit to the notion. In regards to does it sound better than my existing cable that is yet to be determined. I think my goal now is to prove or dis-prove if cable burn-in is a real thing. This whole idea has evolved from if it's an improvement or not over what I use today. We can discuss that later.

I now have the cable connected between a cd player , and a sound bar with a CD playing on repeat. The disc of choice for this burn-in is rather dynamic so it should be a good test. At the end of 16 days (384 hours) I will move the cables to my reference system and do about another 20 hours of additional burn-in to compensate for moving the cable. This will put a total of 452 hours of burn-in on the PH3. When I put this cable back in my system I sure hope it sings because this is a lot to go through to add a cable to your system. Mike if you are right I will eat crow and will preach from the highest mountain top that you are right, and that cable burn-in is REAL.  For me anyway the myth will be considered busted or reinforce my belief that cable burn-in is a bunch of BS. 

For those who will argue the point of cable burn-in I fully understand the concept, and I don't plan to get sucked down that rat hole and I won't argue that....yet because at the end of this test I may be in your camp and I don't want to have a steady diet of crow so for now I will remain neutral on the subject until the test is complete.  However I will be totally transparent and honest about the results. So not trying to make anyone angry as I know beliefs about audio are sensitive subjects, and rightfully so this hobby is expensive and I like you have a substancial investment in this. Just trying to get to the truth. I also understand that cable burn-in may actually happen when you consider it from a scientific perspective, but the real question is can you actually hear the difference.  

I will report back to this thread in 17 days from today (need at least one day to evaluate) with the results. 

happy listening!!

-Keith
barnettk

Showing 6 responses by dorkwad

Keith,

I am one of the dudes Doug mentioned in his post on the Schroeder method of the double Teo's for ICs--he ran into a friend of mine and myself at last years Axpona.  We were outside the Teo room and Taras of Teo Audio came out and joined our conversation.  Doug told us of the results of the double ICs used with Audioquest splitters along with warning us of using them to connect to an amp or integrated amp.  My friend Scott had an extra set of Teo GC ICs and he decided to try this in his system.  His results paralleled Doug's.  He brought his extra set of GC's to my house about a month later.  The single Teo ICs made a very noticeable difference in sound to my all silver wired system when we demoed it a few months ago.  The double Teo GCs made an even bigger difference in sound improvement in all ways to a very transparent, detailed, and dynamic system that I had loved prior.  By the way, I used to have 2 different sets of Morrow ICs--the MA-3 and MA-4's prior to using Darwin or Amadi silver cables.  The silver cables were the first ICs to make a significant difference in sound to lower cost copper cables.

Personally, for me, I don't really care if you try this double IC or not.  I will most likely never know most of the posters in the forum because of location.  Those who don't try this are just plain missing out on WAY more excellent and realistic sound.  If you get your Teo cables used, you can do this at mid priced cost for sure.  Taras says that GC II Jr., their current lowest cost cables, doubled up will sound better than many of their costlier cables in single form.  My opinion of Morrow is it is very tough to tell any sound improvement as you go up the line--impressive marketing however.

My system is VMPS RM40 BCSE MLS speakers, TRL DUDE preamp, Nuforce Ref 9 V3 SE mono amps with TDSS level 3 upgrades, fully upgraded Modwright 5400 Signature Truth, Lenco TT with most of Jean Nantais' mods or upgrades, Pete Riggle Woody arm, Benz Micro Ruby 3, and Whest 3.0 RDT SE phono pre.  All have been modded with SR Blue fuses,  some with Audio Magic Pulse Gen ZX's, upgraded tubes, and Star Sound's trans mod with Audio Points.  The differences in already very good components was obvious to anyone who was there to hear.  We loved it.  Did I want to spend the money to buy the extra cables? NO!  Can I tell you technically anything of importance?  NO!  I was a PE teacher and coach for 38 years--BUT...I can definitely hear.  I bought my buddies extra pair on the spot at used prices.  He keeps wanting to have me move up the Teo line and double those.  Tried it, the rule of less improvement as you pay more kicked in.  

Bob

Wow!  That's good to know, Doug.  Might have to do the same to the ICs going from my preamp to the Nuforce Ref 9 V3 SE monos.  Doug, does this work with identical length and models from other makers besides Teo?

Bob
Hey Keith,

Doug made a pretty strong warning against using the double ICs going to any amplifier.  I don't know enough about electronics to tell you why.  Used from your source to the preamp, they are WAY beyond performance to cost value.

Bob
Got to add one more thing Doug said at Axpona.  I believe he said that ALL components exhibit at least 90% of the sound they will have on first listen.  They will not change perceptibly after that.  If you don't like the sound after you get them (anything including cables and components), you aren't going to like them later either.

I have to say, that has been my experience with all things audio also.  I have not learned to like anything that wasn't good initially after more break in.  However, some things sounded even better after break in.  They didn't change their initial stripes though.

IT IS REALLY NICE to have audio friends that have stuff and don't mind coming over to let you hear the difference in your system BEFORE you buy.  Not always possible, but nice, especially with cables.  Saves lots of angst.
Mr. DB,

Doug Schroeder is one of the prime reviewers of Dagogo Online.   He has 4 reference systems using different types of speakers.  He tries many things, so when he says this also works, it should be good for all.

Bob

Barnettk,

Doug Schroeder just posted on another thread that he has tried this also with the preamp to amp ICs using doubles.  It had the same result as the source to preamp ICs.  Use the same length cables and preferably the same make and model for best results.  I used a Teo GC with a Teo GC II and still had great results.  It's an irresistable improvement!  I will be doing the preamp to amp ICs with double JW Reference ICs.  I love the combination of the Teos with the JW Reference.